# Chapter Select, [[S6E10 - Pokémon Black 2 and White 2]] Transcript This transcription was completed on March 4, 2026 with the application MacWhisper on macOS. This was done automatically, without human input during the transcription process. The transcription used the Parakeet v3 model. My hope is that by offering this transcription – however accurate it may be done by a machine learning/AI – will help you, the listener. I’d love to offer full, proper transcription some day, but that is not feasible at this time. Thank you for listening and reading. I hope you enjoy the show and that this document was helpful. Enjoy. --- So you you got the ring, you're all set? *00:00* No. *00:03* I went in there and um *00:04* Bef last week when I went in, it was like we had figured out three thousand bucks. *00:09* Well, uh so it was weird because like they had to order the diamond, so the diamond wasn't there, and then they had to toy around with the settings. *00:14* So like I couldn't *00:21* pay for it yet because that nothing was in there. *00:22* But I was trading something in towards it and they're like, okay, we'll process the trade though. *00:26* And I was like, okay. *00:30* So they processed the train, we did all the paperwork for that. *00:31* And we got that done. *00:34* And then they stuck it with my like file so that they could like confirm that I had done that. *00:35* And so I go back in the other day and they like check me out for my ring and they're like, it when they when they did all this, I was like, what's it going to exactly be for the ring and everything? *00:39* And they're like, uh, it'll be like 3300 or something. *00:48* like that. *00:51* And I was like, okay, alright, whatever. *00:52* And so I go in there and I pay for it the other day and they're like, that'll be like four thousand something dollars. *00:54* I was like, *01:00* No, I'm like that's not right. *01:01* That's not right. *01:04* Like that's wrong. *01:05* We need to figure this out. *01:06* This is not what it was. *01:07* We figured this all out last week. *01:07* Blah blah blah blah blah. *01:09* The lady's like, okay, all right, let's figure it out. *01:11* And so we started um trying to figure it out. *01:14* And she's like, oh, I see what the problem is. *01:20* We haven't *01:23* applied your trade towards it yet. *01:25* I was like, okay, well that makes sense. *01:27* Because we had processed that individually. *01:28* The rule with the trade though is that I had to double up whatever I was trading in. *01:31* So the I think the total trade was like 24 *01:35* two or three hundred worth of stuff that I traded in. *01:38* But then I had to buy twenty two or twenty three hundred dollars worth of stuff out of pocket for them to right to do that, which makes sense. *01:41* running a business, but and so after all of that it was like a little over three thousand. *01:49* And so they they processed everything though on the spot and they're like, okay, there you go. *01:54* You owe us fifteen hundred dollars. *01:58* And I was like, what? *02:00* And they're like, yep, the fifteen hundred dollars. *02:01* And I was like, that doesn't sound right either, but I'm not gonna say anything. *02:04* I'm not gonna complain about that either. *02:08* And I was like, okay, where do I pay? *02:10* Did you just pay in full then? *02:12* Because I know you said the floor. *02:13* Like a card, like a credit card with them, because I was like, I'm gonna have to pay this off in waves. *02:21* I can't pay it all at once. *02:26* And then they're like $1500. *02:27* I was like, I can actually probably do that. *02:29* I was like, but I just signed it for this stupid card. *02:30* I don't want to put no *02:32* I paid I canceled the card, I would have just shut it down. *02:34* I paid a thousand of it. *02:37* And then I put the rest. *02:39* Yeah, I paid a thousand cash and then I put like five hundred on the card. *02:40* And they're like, oh, we they're like, we'll see you soon because you'll have to come get wedding bands and all that stuff. *02:43* I'm like, yeah, that's true, whatever. *02:48* So after all the wedding stuff, I'd just kill the card. *02:50* You don't need the *02:53* Killing cards hurts your credit score sometimes though. *02:54* That's the thing. *02:57* So are you all set then? *02:58* I mean you have the ring obviously, but you're ready to rock and roll on the I still don't know how exactly *03:00* Won't do it. *03:08* I mean I d I broadly know. *03:09* It's just gonna be like Christmas morning, but I don't know like *03:10* Like trying to I I I figured like I was thinking about it yesterday. *03:16* I was like, I should probably sketch out something I want to say specifically. *03:19* I win the mine. *03:24* I worked so hard on like the whole *03:25* the theatrics of it that I didn't even really know what I was gonna say. *03:28* I mean yeah mine's very not theatrical but also that's not Oh mine yeah mine wouldn't me. *03:32* Like I just don't I'm not saying you need to be like me. *03:38* Well it's just are you going to film it at all? *03:43* I know that's a thing people like. *03:46* You don't have to. *03:47* I did it I did it mostly because I think Abby wanted it. *03:49* That's why I did it. *03:52* So last night we were at *03:54* uh some like Christmas restaurant slash like little village thing with the kids. *03:56* There was a point where Danielle and her daughter went off to the bathroom for like five or ten minutes. *04:03* It was just me and Rhett. *04:07* And I like debated telling him. *04:08* I was very close. *04:11* And then I was like, dude, if he blows my cover, I'm gonna be very mad. *04:13* So I was like, I wouldn't trust an eight-year-old with a secret for like three days, I wouldn't do that. *04:18* Yeah. *04:23* I was very close and then I was like, I can't do it. *04:23* I'll just have to 'cause if he mentions something, yeah, I'll be upset. *04:27* Yeah. *04:32* Yeah. *04:32* And so I was like, okay, never mind. *04:33* So *04:36* Yeah. *04:37* Yeah. *04:38* I almost told him, but uh no, I mean I don't know. *04:38* I'm trying to decide if I want to do it first or last. *04:42* I'm thinking last. *04:45* Last. *04:48* I I think last. *04:49* Almost a almost a Christmas story way. *04:51* Like where the big present is the last present. *04:53* Yeah, that's what I think is right. *04:55* I'm not saying hide it and be like, oh we'll chill. *04:58* She's kind of expecting it *05:00* I mean obviously we have talked enough about it where she like expects it but also like she's not at all. *05:03* Cause she's been asking *05:12* No, somebody told me the people at the ringstore when I picked it up, they're like, they're like, you should hint that she should get her nails done. *05:15* I'm like, I'm not doing that. *05:21* That'll absolutely indicate *05:22* Yes. *05:25* Like it's it's a very hard thing to do. *05:25* You basically have to go through three other people to get the one person to do it. *05:28* I don't even know if I had Abby get hers done. *05:32* Yeah. *05:34* It's so because it's like, hey babe, you should go get your nails done. *05:34* Yeah, no thank you. *05:38* It really all you can hope there is she's getting her nails done because she's going home with you for Christmas. *05:40* That's all you can hope for. *05:45* And whatever. *05:48* She'll get her nails done as soon if she didn't before, she'll get them done right after. *05:48* Like she'll get them done in day and bell. *05:52* I I don't know. *05:57* I mean she will. *05:58* No, I'm just saying in my experience they like to do up their nails after they get new new jewelry. *05:59* It's not even like a social *06:06* like everybody on Instagram look. *06:08* It's more just like uh if they like I don't know. *06:10* It's a girl thing. *06:12* For themselves. *06:13* Yeah. *06:14* I'm not saying she's like, oh, I gotta share it with everybody in the world. *06:14* It's more uh I w I mean w she even asked me about it yesterday. *06:18* She w said something like Like we when we were at the place she she's like have you even like She's like obviously we've talked about getting married and stuff and blah blah blah blah She's like do you even know how you would like *06:22* Wanna do it? *06:35* I was like, I don't and I was like, I'm just trying to play dumb. *06:36* I'm like, I don't know, not really. *06:39* And she's like I mean that's a hard that's an aggressive dumb *06:41* Well, the other day though, she asked me, what did you get me for Christmas? *06:45* And I said, Oh, a diamond engagement ring. *06:48* And she said, Stop it. *06:50* Don't lie to me like that. *06:51* Oh, you pulled like a Walter Light. *06:54* It's like *06:56* Like when Hank has the bag full of money he's like, Oh, what you got in there? *06:57* Half a million in cash. *07:01* What do you got in there? *07:03* Half million in cash *07:09* That's a spirit. *07:17* I got it, I got it. *07:22* Yes. *07:27* Yeah. *07:27* Oh that's a bold that was a bold joke. *07:29* Yes. *07:31* Very bold. *07:32* It's a very much field in the moment. *07:35* I said it in such a way that she like could tell I was like joking. *07:37* Yeah. *07:42* It's all delivery. *07:43* And she's like, stop it. *07:44* Don't say that. *07:45* That don't like make me sad. *07:46* And I was like, heh heh heh heh heh hehehehe Are you gonna see them before Christmas at all? *07:48* Yeah, I'm staying the night at their place on Christmas Eve. *07:54* Me and the dog are going over tomorrow and then I will be out of town for like the next eight or nine days. *07:56* Okay. *08:01* Gotcha. *08:02* You should see if she should check and just see if her nails are done. *08:02* See if she like subtly knows. *08:06* We'll see *08:08* All right, let me run to the restroom before we start this. *08:10* Apologies. *08:12* Sounds good. *08:13* No, you're fine. *08:14* Just want to make sure we don't have to stop. *08:14* So I'll be right back. *08:16* Hello everybody and welcome to Chapter Select, a seasonal retrospective podcast where we bounce back and forth between a series exploring its evolution, design, and legacy for the season six finale. *08:18* We are covering the Pokemon franchise for one last time. *08:29* My name is Max Roberts, and I am joined, as always, by Logan Moore. *08:34* Hi, Logan. *08:37* Max is Tony Stark once said, Part of the journey is the end. *08:38* And this is Did he say that? *08:43* I think he said it in one of the in-game trailers, yeah. *08:45* And this has been a very long trailer. *08:49* Or a very long season, not trailer. *08:51* This has been our longest season by far, at least on our side when it comes to *08:53* Production playing and all that stuff. *08:58* I looked it up today. *09:00* I started playing Pokemon Leaf Green in April of 2022, so it's been about 20 months. *09:02* I guess the only longer season would have been Paper Mario, but that's partially because we had the idea of chapter select, I want to say like *09:10* For a good twelve to eighteen months we're like, yeah, we should do this. *09:17* And we'll start with Paper Mario. *09:20* And then for like twelve months, neither of us played Paper Mario. *09:21* And then we're like, are we gonna do this idea for a podcast we have? *09:24* And *09:27* Finally eventually we did. *09:28* But yes, this has been the longest season by a mile, I feel like. *09:30* We've played these. *09:35* It has. *09:36* I I sent you so I be I beat the game the day we're recording this *09:36* And uh this morning I sent you that iconic image of Frodo saying, It's done. *09:41* Yes. *09:46* Yeah. *09:47* I feel like Frodo at the end of the journey. *09:47* Yeah, it's um *09:50* This has been a lot. *09:52* I don't I don't know. *09:53* I uh here's the thing though, and we'll we'll have a larger discussion once we get to the end about the Pokemon series as a whole and just this *09:54* Hold the games we've played, but I'm glad we did this. *10:00* It has been a huge undertaking, and I think this is one of one of the one seasons that we wanted to do the most, but we knew would be *10:03* the absolute most daunting on paper just because of the sheer number. *10:11* Well, I just think the time allotment per each game combined with the number of games in this series. *10:16* It's about two hundred hours of gameplay a minimum. *10:23* I think it's way more than that. *10:27* I don't know. *10:29* I feel like I feel like gold and silver for us alone though was like sixty *10:33* Because we did the true ending of that one where we're like we're like we have to beat red in order to record. *10:36* So we both did that, and that took like 60 or 70 hours for each of us. *10:44* So that was a gauntlet. *10:47* That was a gauntlet. *10:49* So it's been a lot. *10:50* It's been a long, long season. *10:52* Definitely three or four hundred hours of gameplay, I would imagine. *10:53* Probably. *10:57* Yeah. *10:57* I wrote them all down. *10:58* I should just actually tally it up, but *10:59* I mean my pro my problem is I leaves I leave my DS or Game Boys or Switch running kind of in the background sometimes and so the hours stack up and I don't know what they actually are. *11:01* Also, this is like an *11:11* But I've noticed like if I put my DS in sleep mode, like close the case and then open it back up some t for some reason the time keeps running in the background on these DS games. *11:15* I don't know if it's like that on the 3DS games. *11:25* But I know it is on the base DS game, because I'll go to save and it'll be like it'll I'll have like five hours more than I thought I should, and I'm like, that doesn't seem *11:27* Exactly right. *11:37* Suspicious. *11:39* Very suspicious, Iwada. *11:40* So it's hard to know exactly how many hours I poured into it, but yes, this has been an undertaking. *11:42* And now it makes me wonder we did do it. *11:48* Now it makes me wonder what other things we could do in the future. *11:50* Obviously we've already talked about Metroid and Castlevania. *11:53* Yeah, I'm I'm curious to see how Castlevania's gonna go with so many. *11:59* Although that's a very varied lineup of games, I think. *12:03* To some deg uh to some degree. *12:07* Like there's gonna be a lot of things. *12:09* Yes. *12:12* Three GBA games and three DS games and Symphony of the Night and *12:14* Yeah, all that stuff's gonna be similar. *12:17* But anyway, yeah. *12:19* Black two is the end. *12:20* And I wanna we'll save this. *12:22* Actually, this will be my first question for you once we do the rundown. *12:25* So let's go ahead and do the rundown and then we'll *12:28* We'll talk about Black and White 2 here. *12:30* Sounds good. *12:33* For the final time here in season 6, Pokemon Black 2 and White 2 were developed by Game Freak. *12:34* They came to the Nintendo DS. *12:41* They launched on October 7th, 2012 in North America. *12:43* This was into the lifespan of the Nintendo 3DS. *12:46* So these were some of the final. *12:49* base DS games ever, or not base, but just standard Nintendo DS games that ever released. *12:52* The game director was Takao Uno. *12:58* Or I think that's how you spell it. *13:01* Or say it. *13:03* The producers were Junichi Masuda, Hitoshi Yamagami, and Shusaki Egami. *13:04* The music this time was only done by Go Ichinose and Hitomi Sato. *13:09* The Metacritic score on these games was an 80 out of 100, which am I wrong, but is this a drastic drop-off compared to *13:14* Black one and white one were eighty-seven. *13:23* Okay, that's what I thought. *13:26* Seven point drop. *13:27* That's what I thought. *13:29* And I mean generally speaking, this is kind of where I wanted to kick things off for our discussion, but I kind of agree with that drop. *13:30* And the Metacritic Score? *13:37* I know you and I talked before this season about how we felt like this these were the only true Pokemon sequels, you know. *13:39* In the larger series, obviously like Gold and Silver are kind of more sequels to. *13:47* I mean, there there's there's ties to the Canto stuff in those games. *13:52* So those those kind of feel like direct sequels. *13:55* Um *13:58* to the original games. *13:59* But these are the only numbered sequels in the whole entry in the whole series, and we felt like that was different than you know the expanded versions like Emerald and Platinum and those sorts of things. *14:00* So we want to make sure we play these. *14:09* After having done that, I don't know if we needed to in some ways. *14:11* And I'm curious what your thoughts are, because this is what I wanted to ask you up front. *14:18* Like *14:22* I don't feel like these games add a whole lot else to Unova and to this black and white chronology. *14:23* Overall. *14:32* Like there's some little additional wrinkles here and there, but for the most part, there's not a lot going on in this game that I feel like is super vital or all that engaging. *14:33* So it's *14:44* It feels like a very weird sequel. *14:47* It doesn't do the sequel stuff that I wanted it to do. *14:49* Yeah. *14:53* Um *14:53* It mostly expands on it in a gameplay fashion. *14:54* You know, it expands the decks right out of the gate, no more restriction to just Unova they bring in from all the other four generations up front. *14:58* Some gameplay changes and things like that. *15:06* But on the whole, it's I feel like we still should have played it because of these gameplay differences and kind of to understand this duology of games. *15:09* Which is unique within the franchise, but this is not what I was hoping for when *15:21* when we sat down and said, Oh, we're gonna play black one and two, especially after all the hype that uh people talk about, you know, black and white and its sequels so fondly. *15:29* I think maybe people are lumping the two together and that's kind of it's kind of like uh what is it, rising tide lifts all ships. *15:39* Like I think th Black One being *15:48* as w you know, is what it is, elevates Black Two a bit. *15:50* Um but the story and the world and stuff weren't as engaging as they were before. *15:55* It's mostly gameplay improvements and some *16:00* uh regressions that I think make this game stand out. *16:03* Yeah, I think that's what's weird is like I don't know. *16:06* I for the most part I feel like nowadays, like in 2023 when people look back and talk about these games, I hear more praise for *16:09* the sequels than I do the original games. *16:17* Like, oh, I didn't like black and white, but the sequels improved on a lot of things, you know, that that I didn't like in those games. *16:19* And I I feel the complete *16:24* opposite. *16:27* Like I think black, white black and white one are both far better games and I think they have better stories and better characters and *16:27* They're just doing more interesting things in a general sense. *16:35* Like a lot of the There are aspects of these sequels that I do like. *16:39* I like the Um *16:43* Like starting off in a different area, like the first two gems or whatever that you go to are different. *16:45* Um I like how they fold in characters from the previous games. *16:50* There is a time jump so you kind of get an idea of like what everybody's doing. *16:53* I think I mean that's mainly though an association with like Sharon and with *16:57* Is it is it Bianca then? *17:01* Yep. *17:03* Sharon Bianca. *17:03* Um so that's kind of fun, but that stuff starts to sort of fade as the game goes on as well. *17:05* And then I think there was more potential with like the Team Plasma arc in this game than what they do with it. *17:11* Like I w I really thought that there was they did something with Team Plasma in this game? *17:16* I mean *17:21* I missed that beat. *17:22* Yeah, I I think there was p a lot of potential with these games and then having played through it again, like, I was just very surprised by how little they actually *17:23* Do. *17:36* Um and so yeah, I'm left feeling kind of just like indifferent towards these games in some ways. *17:37* I I I still think generally speaking, like so *17:43* This episode's going to be a bit different because we've already done the, you know. *17:47* We've talked about the broad beats of Unova, like the decks and the map and the gems, and like things like that in our previous episode. *17:51* So like *17:58* Broadly speaking, I still like the decks a lot in this game. *17:59* I still like a lot of the Pokemon. *18:02* They fold in other Pokemon from other regions and things like that. *18:03* So like I think it's *18:06* for the better in that manner. *18:07* But yeah, for the most part, I just don't think any of the new additions here stand out all that much and I don't think they're any more engaging than like what was in the the previous games by any means. *18:09* It's so it's difficult because I feel like Game Freak had such a good template for a sequel already in Gold and Silver. *18:20* And I'm not saying they needed to add a whole new region and then connect the two, not retrace their steps there, but the way that Johto and Kanto connected and the stories intertwined and the characters overlapped. *18:30* red being this final challenge up a mountain type of thing. *18:40* Like they had all of this great world building already established *18:44* 15 years prior, and it just doesn't seem that present here. *18:50* It's this does feel like that *18:56* third game entry idea, that crystal, that um yellow emerald type expansion from the previous game, and not so much a full blown sequel as *19:00* We see here and I guess in other ideas, it really does feel like oh, we're just in the same place. *19:15* Here's some references to the previous game, and uh *19:23* Have fun with the new Pokemon and just like a slightly different route. *19:28* That's what I was gonna say. *19:31* Is it it felt like the Pokemon series by this point. *19:32* had entered the entered the phase where they had gotten accustomed Game Freak had gotten used to, you know, doing a third entry, you know, Crystal, followed by Emerald, followed by Platinum. *19:36* And with these games it was like *19:45* Black and White 2 feel like they're very much like, well, we have to do this. *19:47* Like this is the kind of the pattern we've outlined for ourselves here, so we have to do something new. *19:50* And they're like, well, what if we just didn't do, you know, an expanded version? *19:56* What if we did sequels? *20:00* And I think that's an interesting idea, but again *20:02* Scheme feels very half baked in that manner. *20:05* Like it doesn't feel like I think the credits even kind of indicate as much because the credits we were looking at this beforehand and like when you go back and look at the the producer and director and *20:08* composer credits for the for black and white they're far more extensive compared to the sequels, which are very much slimmed down. *20:20* And so it's clear that they had fewer people working on these games, and that kind of shows with some of the story stuff, I think, in particular, where it just it there's the story is only *20:28* I feel like the story is only really comes to a head at like a couple different parts of the game compared to black and white, where I feel like it really kind of overarked it over across the whole journey and they were good about, you know, sprinkling in things here and there. *20:40* with every new town you would go to, that is absolutely not the case with this game. *20:53* And I feel like a lot of the story stuff is backloaded. *20:58* It is just *21:02* Yeah, it it just feels like they they they were committed to releasing an expanded version of the Unova games in some manner. *21:04* They decided to go down this route instead, you know. *21:11* That was probably partially based on the thought of like, well, what if we did two versions rather than one? *21:15* That'll make us even more money, you know? *21:21* Like I'm sure that was a factor to a degree. *21:23* I *21:27* It's cause a year after this game came out is when X and Y came out. *21:28* So I feel like we're going to be a good thing. *21:33* The core game three team was absolutely working on X and Y by this *21:34* Point. *21:38* Yeah. *21:38* That's what I was s gonna say is I feel like the team was kinda working on the next big game while *21:39* n I'm not saying the B team, but just, you know, a smaller team was working on black and white too. *21:46* And you imagine, you know, the game came out roughly eighteen months after Black and White One. *21:51* I'm sure the development time on this was way, way reduced because they had the map, they had character models, they had the engine. *21:59* They really just had to do new sprites for any of the Pokemon they were bringing in and *22:06* I mean there's the national decks in black and white. *22:11* I was gonna say, I mean you're talking about they probably didn't even have to do too much sprite work and they just kind of had to do the new assets, the new areas, characters and um new Pokemon and stuff. *22:13* I do have uh a video that'll be in the show notes. *22:24* It's one of those Digino Gaming videos. *22:27* I watched it a while ago while we were pre-prepping this season. *22:29* I haven't watched it recently, but it's it's titled What Happened to Pokemon Grey and *22:32* Pokemon Z, which would have been, you know, kind of before they started just doing DLC or I guess Ultrasun and Ultra Moon were expanded versions as well. *22:36* And so I'll put that in there, but it I it has some interesting stories in there that I uh remember hearing about. *22:45* So I think that'll be it at least an insightful video of *22:51* This weird it it's really a true transition for the Pokemon franchise out of not only 2D to 3D, but you know, an expanded single version of a game to multiple games and *22:56* 3D remakes and then we'll move on to DLC and big transition period for the game freak and the IP. *23:08* I think let's let's dig in a little bit deeper here rather than talking broadly. *23:16* I think the best way to do that probably first is just *23:19* to talking about the story a bit more, because I feel like that is obviously w we talked at the end of the last episode about how like I I feel like Black and White One really set the stage well for these games, yeah, especially with how it ends with the, you know, N flying off on the backs of one of the legendary Pokemon. *23:22* It's like, okay, he's still out there. *23:36* He's still going to be present in the sequels. *23:38* And he does have a role in these games. *23:39* Barely. *23:42* I mean, he just kind of shows up and he's like, oh, let me drop my legendary Pokemon here. *23:43* Oh no, it got absorbed by the other one. *23:47* It feels like he's only there to. *23:49* To lead to a cool moment where the two legendaries fuse more than anything else. *23:51* Um and so that's pretty disappointing. *23:56* But I I I mentioned this before, but like *23:59* Team Plasma's Arc in this, I think I I would I would I'm very much fine with the idea of you know Getsis coming back and just being like I'm out for revenge my plan failed two years ago I tried to *24:02* I I I I in fact I really like his character in this game. *24:15* Like two years ago I tried to, you know, sway the people of Unova with my with with *24:18* my the these these fake ideals and my this fake this fake this plan that I had and now I'm just gonna take over UNOVA by force. *24:24* Like I like that idea *24:33* Like it's very funny. *24:35* Yes. *24:39* There's no impact if you don't know from the first game. *24:40* Yes. *24:43* Team Plasma's entire arc in this game is very much just like *24:44* We're kind of still alive, but we don't really have a plan. *24:48* And they they're just kind of there for the first three-fourths of the game, and then all of a sudden they come out of nowhere and light a town up with ice. *24:52* And then *25:01* Kairem shows up and then they just sort of toss him in there out of nowhere. *25:03* Like, it's very I said before that the story is very backloaded, but it is like they freeze the town and then *25:08* And then you go and you do you fight a bunch of villains, and then you get sus shows up again, and you fight him, and then the legendary stuff. *25:16* Even the legendary stuff in this game is super underwhelming. *25:23* You just fight. *25:26* the fuse kairim and then it's like, oh no, it ran off, but don't worry, it'll be back. *25:27* And that's about it. *25:32* And then there's another showdown between Getis and N, but it's *25:33* There's it's so anticlimactic. *25:37* Like there's just they had so much potential here. *25:40* And I think if Getsis was more face forward and was just, you know *25:43* from the start of the game, like I'm back and I'm taking over the region by force this time. *25:48* No more no more trying to play nice or pretend that I'm a good guy and convince you all to release your Pokemon naturally. *25:53* I'm just gonna *26:00* exert my will this time round, through the power of this legendary Pokemon I have. *26:02* I think if that would have been an overarching thing that had kind of presented itself far earlier in the game, then this story would have been way more compelling. *26:05* Cause then you could have introduced N and stuff like that, been *26:13* had him come back and be like, okay, I gotta stop him again. *26:16* Like there's just a lot of i th this is where it feels like they ran out of time. *26:19* You know, talking about the cr compressed development timeline. *26:25* There is it's just so apparent that they could have done more in this game, but they did not because this was such a quick turnaround on this. *26:28* game and it leads to the game feeling hollow and yeah I don't know I mean like I said generally totally fine with an evil mustache trolling villain coming back and just be like I'm gonna *26:36* light up the world with ice and all sorts like that's fine. *26:46* That's goofy. *26:49* It's Pokemon. *26:50* That's g that's that's totally, totally solid. *26:52* But it's just that it doesn't have an impact over the course of the entire game that *26:55* left me feeling wanting. *26:59* Yeah, I mean I wrote down that there's almost zero plasma plot, uh six badges in, which yeah, that's pretty *27:02* substantial. *27:09* I mean they show up and they're around, but they they kinda like, remember us from two years ago? *27:10* We're we're here and we have new costumes. *27:16* Let's fight. *27:18* It's there's no even even Professor Juniper's like, oh, they're talking about this really cold dragon. *27:19* Come listen to this old lady tell a story. *27:26* Yeah. *27:29* And she's like, go talk to the dragon man to learn about the dragons. *27:29* And it's like, why couldn't have this been seeded earlier? *27:33* Like maybe you're learning about the lore, or as a new protagonist, you go back and you're learning about the things that happened two years ago, and maybe your your rival, your friend, *27:37* uh is also like this lens to learn about the past because he's got major beef with with team plasma that's not really revealed until the midway point either the source of that. *27:48* But instead, your character feels pretty oblivious to everything that happened two years ago. *28:00* And everyone's just like, remember that time two years ago? *28:05* Oh, two years ago. *28:08* But we're not moving forward or developing an evil plot here until the very end where it's just like, haha, I am here to freeze everyone. *28:11* Let me fuse Pokemon. *28:21* I think one of the other biggest problems that I had with this game is that like there's so much talk about what happened two years ago and so much *28:22* But like with those original games, your main protagonist, especially compared to this game, it has a pretty intrinsic role to the plot. *28:30* And has it it plays a pivotal part, you know, in end's development and in the other characters development. *28:38* And so for all of those characters to come back, but the main protagonist that you played as from the previous game to just be completely absent. *28:44* feels very strange, and I know that's a hard dynamic to balance because it's like that player character is supposed to be the player themselves sort of in this world. *28:52* But they've done stuff like this in the past, you know, again with red. *29:02* Yes. *29:06* Like, so I feel like they needed to bring back the protagonist from the first games. *29:07* I think the protagonist should have been the champion. *29:12* That would have been a great part. *29:15* I think that's exactly what should have like and could have been there helping out along. *29:16* It's not the first time that they've just taken a a character that you would name *29:22* Uh like in reading up about this game I learned that the rival's like canonical name is Hugh, you know, not whatever you give them. *29:26* Yeah. *29:32* So it's like they could easily have just given them the default name that whatever the the names are in that in black and white one. *29:33* But just to name him black or name him whiter, whatever. *29:40* Like it doesn't matter. *29:43* You can name it M instead of N. *29:45* But the *29:48* Also, having the friends of your protagonist from the previous game just not really refer to it or acknowledge it in a major way. *29:50* Like Sharon being like *29:58* Two years ago a thing happened. *30:01* Or Bianca just being like, I'm gonna investigate that. *30:03* Your character from the previous games was the one who saved everyone and rescued everything and they just don't even like acknowledge that there was a person that did that. *30:07* Even N doesn't acknowledge it. *30:15* N just says, I learned a lesson, you know, two years ago about how humans and Pokemon can be together. *30:17* It's it just feels so for a sequel, it feels so disconnected. *30:21* Mm-hmm. *30:26* And then you're original game. *30:27* And like you were saying, it makes the character in this game feel like this is the most like blank slate, like non like I your character in this game does not have any part that I feel like they play. *30:29* Like especially looking back. *30:43* Yes. *30:46* Like especially looking back at some of the previous games, you know. *30:46* Um like I always think of like I feel like the the game where they do this best is like *30:49* Like with uh Ruby and Sapphire, where it's like, oh, you're the new kid in town and your dad's a gym leader and stuff like that. *30:53* It's like you have like your character kind of has like certain defining characteristics and relationships and things like that. *30:59* And that is just totally not the case. *31:04* in this game whatsoever. *31:06* The only thing you're really introduced at z is this character from a small town. *31:08* You have our sort of rival who keeps whining about his sister's *31:12* Perloin that was kidnapped, and he whines about that for quite literally the entire game. *31:16* He's the most one note rival ever. *31:21* Yeah. *31:24* It's it's interesting to call him a rival because *31:25* He doesn't even want to be the champion. *31:29* He is very focused in I must get revenge, which is interesting. *31:31* Because even at Victory Road, he's like, let me fight you one more time. *31:35* And then he encourages you to go become champion. *31:38* Like that's not his desire. *31:40* I think he harps on I think it takes too long to figure out that like the Pokemon has significance beyond its sisters, like it was his grandfather's. *31:42* that he gave to his little sister. *31:52* Like, I feel like there could have been more character development instead of him just being mad the entire time. *31:54* It just it felt *32:00* One note in that way. *32:01* And there's no problem with like a hot head rival either. *32:02* That's kind of but like his just his *32:05* He doesn't You will feel my full rage He doesn't really change over the course of the game in any substantial manner and yeah, like you were saying, like *32:09* Go ahead. *32:19* I did like his one line though after he gets the the cat back, the Leop Leopard or something. *32:19* And he's like *32:27* Well, if we let Team Plasma go, no more Pokemon will be hurt. *32:28* Like this one. *32:32* Like that actually was like, Oh he's struggling with this right now. *32:32* Like he just got the cat back, but it's been brainwashed by these like ghost ninja assassins. *32:36* And he's like, maybe they should just do what they want. *32:42* So no one else gets hurt. *32:45* I thought that was cool, but again, you have no time to actually sit in that because the next time you see him, he's like *32:46* I'm gonna battle you one more time. *32:52* Again, very backlog. *32:53* It only happens at the very end of the game. *32:55* Like three fourths of this game is so much the same. *32:56* And you go to every town *33:01* And every town is basically identical in structure, except there's maybe like one very tiny new thing that they throw in. *33:04* Like *33:13* I think of like the cold storage area is gone and now there's like this little Yeah, now it's this new new little battle arena thing. *33:13* Which is kinda cool. *33:20* I like that tournament set that tournament sort of I d I learned *33:21* That the if you go through that and you beat the champion of the PWT, that's the real life Pokemon World champion at the time. *33:26* Uh, I forget the guy's name. *33:35* That's cool. *33:36* But yeah, I watched a documentary about it and so they put him in the game because he he had won three years in a row. *33:37* He's the only three-time VGC champion. *33:44* So it was that's you know, that's cool. *33:46* I like that. *33:49* Like I like that inclusion, but then I think of like, you know, um south of one of the towns there's that whole little like *33:50* stretch where they're like, oh, you can bring people here and they'll open shops on streets and just talk to people around the world and you can get them to come here. *33:58* And I like talk to everybody in the game and never found anybody who's like, yeah, I'm looking to open up a shop on a random street or whatever. *34:05* So like I really don't think they flesh that out. *34:12* Like that's what I'm saying. *34:15* Like every town you go to has like one like very tiny difference or they make you go out of order in certain times. *34:16* Like the Dragon Town is basically the same, but it gets frozen over, and also it's the seventh badge instead of the eighth badge. *34:23* It's just like very, very tiny, tiny things that don't matter in the grand scheme of things, but like *34:30* I don't know. *34:36* I will say I did like that they make you go you get up to like the top point of the western side of the map and then you jump to the eastern side of the map. *34:37* That makes the whole map feel more kind of you've been everywhere. *34:45* by the end of the game because I know in the previous game you're like, oh, I feel like this game's gonna keep going onward because I haven't gone to any of the cities on the eastern part of the map. *34:49* I'm like, oh, you don't until the postgame. *34:58* That's the secret. *35:00* So I do like that they try to make use of more of the full UNOVA map, even though I guess the bottom section is just completely left out because you don't go into any of those initial first. *35:02* Yeah, you don't go back to *35:13* You don't go to the part where you started in the first game until the post-game. *35:14* Like that's the new post-game area, which is it's cute. *35:18* And they created the whole new area in the lower left corner. *35:20* It's um *35:24* You know, if you've if you played the first game, and especially for us, because we played these back to back, you know, you can see like the characters and the changes there and stuff, but it's it's nothing to *35:26* substantial. *35:38* Like I don't feel characters really grew or changed all that much. *35:39* I think actually like Sharon I think has a major s *35:43* Uh maybe not major, but him being the very first gym leader that you face and it's a bunch of weak Pokemon, it's like almost feels like punishment for his quest to become the best and the strongest. *35:47* Yeah. *35:59* And I I *36:00* So I just don't care too much for that. *36:01* I think Bianca I I do feel satisfaction with Bianca's arc though. *36:03* She found *36:07* A calling and something she wants to do, and she's out there doing it and exploring and researching. *36:09* I think that's actually pretty cool *36:14* But even her role fades as the game goes onward. *36:16* Like not that she needs to have a major pivotal part by any means. *36:18* She doesn't really in the first game either. *36:22* Um *36:24* But yeah, like you just kind of she sorts starts to fall off the longer you play. *36:25* Um I wanna I wanna even meet the professor till halfway through. *36:29* Yeah, that's it. *36:33* Which whatever *36:34* It's fine, I guess. *36:35* The one other person that we haven't mentioned that I wanted to go back and talk about in association with plasma, there's a couple other things I wanted to mention. *36:36* and association with plasma and their kind of arc in this game. *36:43* And I feel like Team Plasma is important because there's a lot of again, there's just a lot that they could have done with them as a group in these games to make these sequels *36:46* Way better. *36:54* And they just don't. *36:55* They introduce like another antagonist with Colrus, who's like not even an antagonist for like half the game until just kind of *36:55* Science purist? *37:05* Yeah, and then he just sort of shows up very late in the game and he's like, Oh yeah, I've teamed with partnered with Team Plasma and I'm trying to bring the strength out of Pokemon and blah blah blah blah blah and it's like uh okay, sure, and you fight him. *37:06* And he's like, oh, you beat me. *37:19* Goodbye. *37:21* It's just there's no real arcand Team Plasma now. *37:22* Yeah, there's no real arc with him at all. *37:25* He's just kind of this new guy with a weird haircut that keeps showing up. *37:27* And you're like, okay, who is this guy? *37:31* And you think he's gonna have a larger part to play, and he never really does. *37:33* Because even then he's still second in command of Getzus, like *37:36* So I I feel like it would have been better if they would have almost made him the final boss, like have Getzus come in and be like, I need revenge and this *37:40* Colverse is like, no, actually we as Team Plasma now have new ideals and a new motive, and you're the past and I'm the future, and ah I'm the true villain and *37:48* Nope, nothing like that ever happens. *37:57* It's just kind of like I'm a science boy and I have a weird haircut and I've decided to partner with Team Plasma. *38:00* Oh darn you beat me. *38:05* I guess I'll *38:06* disband a group now. *38:08* He's he's a very strange character. *38:10* It's a it's a weird one. *38:13* I *38:14* Yeah, it's just it it's just more botched character development and story progression. *38:16* Yes, yes. *38:21* I I I I don't know. *38:22* It it's he's definitely one of the most recognizable people just because of that haircut, but *38:24* Again, final thing I want to say regarding the plasma too and like just the potential and what they could have done. *38:29* I love the idea that like Team Plasma has fractured. *38:34* Because even in the first games you saw this, like some people were like questioning, you would run into random grunts throughout the game and they're like, I don't know if I should be with this group. *38:38* Should I leave? *38:46* This doesn't sound right. *38:47* And like, so so the first games did a great job of like setting up that like not everybody in Team Plasma was on board with what the group was doing, and obviously by the end of that game. *38:48* They kind of disband and pe now there's a bunch of former Team Plasma people in these games. *38:59* There's like you meet whole sex of them. *39:04* I think of the one that gives you the Zorua in north of one of the towns. *39:06* I think the fifth *39:10* town. *39:11* Rude, I think. *39:11* Yeah. *39:12* Rude or Rude. *39:13* So there's like some of the former like major team plasma members that are like, oh yeah, now we don't follow the group and we're trying to *39:15* rehabilitate or we're trying to rectify our wrongs from the past, which I think is a good idea. *39:21* I don't understand why you don't then have like this anti-teen plasma like go up against the *39:27* current team plasma or anything like that. *39:33* Like again, there's just so many things they set up that would make sense for logical like big story moments and then they just never happen. *39:35* And it's like oh, well they do kind of have them fight there right before the f *39:43* Yeah, a little bit. *39:47* But it's I almost wish they kind of were sprinkled in more, spreading the gospel of *39:49* We have changed and we're trying to mend what we did two years ago, but they only come up every now and then and I feel like it's not *39:56* It doesn't feel as widespread or immersed in the world. *40:06* I think it would have been better to see these different sex rehabilitating *40:09* in each town or have people travel and they're spreading the word kind of like Team Plasma was in the first game, but a different message this time. *40:15* It's *40:23* But it is cool to see them and also they're they're trying to serve Lord and still. *40:24* And there is a I don't know if you did this, but you can link your previous save *40:29* to this game and if you interact with certain NPCs you get these flashback sequences that show what happened in the intervening years. *40:36* I did not do that. *40:43* So I saw a couple of those. *40:44* I didn't like seek them all out, but a couple of them and they show *40:46* Like one was uh these Team Plasma members talking about where is Lord N? *40:49* Like why is he forsaken us? *40:56* Is what we were doing right or wrong? *40:58* Should we be for plasma or against it? *41:00* And they have this long cutscene about it. *41:02* And then N shows up at the end and stuff in this flashback sequence. *41:04* And it's *41:08* It's a shame that that was locked behind sinking saves. *41:09* I get that's cool. *41:14* But like a way to reward people for playing both. *41:16* It definitely rewards people who are play who played both, yes. *41:19* But it just like I don't know that it's it that's good story stuff that's locked behind save progression, essentially. *41:23* Yeah, I I it's I don't know. *41:33* There's just uh there's uh these games more than a lot of other Pokemon games that we have played o over the course of this season, I just have questions. *41:36* about like what happened here. *41:43* Like, again, lots of potential, lots of good ideas at a baseline level. *41:46* Why wasn't this expanded on? *41:52* What exactly went down? *41:54* Like you can see where this game would have been like fantastic, one of the best in the series. *41:56* And then they just don't go far enough in certain areas. *42:02* and it really ends up dragging it all down. *42:06* Again, chalk a lot of it up to probably development time and the fact that a smaller team was working on this game with a compressed development time. *42:08* And that's probably the reason why it is like this, but *42:17* Alas, you know. *42:21* I don't know. *42:22* This is the game we were given as a result. *42:23* Yeah, it feels more of like a bummer than ending on the high note that I was kind of into *42:26* Based off word of mouth. *42:32* Yeah. *42:33* I did want to ask you about, I mean, last sort of story thing I think we should touch on is just the legendary. *42:34* I mean, we we we mentioned that there's really not a lot to say. *42:39* I I will say I like *42:44* That team plasma gains control of the legendary and then puts it to use by trying to take over the re-like that's a new thing. *42:46* Like *42:55* Typically the leaders are, you know, vying for the legendary Pokemon of the region, and they never uh either plans are always thwarted right beforehand, and then the player character gets a hold of the legendary for themselves. *42:55* Whatever, that's typically how it goes down. *43:08* I like that they do get a hold of Kyrim this time around, and then they again start freezing things up. *43:11* I also like the idea that there is I mean it's kinda tacky. *43:16* I mean this is my problem with Kairim kind of overall and how they pitch him in this game is that in the previous games, like Zekrom and Resheram are supposed to be like a yin and yang type thing like *43:20* They keep each other in check and in balance and then it and this game it's like, oh yeah, but there's also one other one that everybody forgets about. *43:30* And it's like *43:37* Okay. *43:39* Yeah the twins, the truth and ideals. *43:47* And this is like the husk of the *43:49* Yeah. *43:52* The one the the one body. *43:52* So it's it's cool. *43:54* I think that Plasma Team Plasma was so integrated into the lore of the Inova region to like use these Pokemon and that they would exploit that lore. *43:56* in history to uh, you know, abuse and manipulate Pokemon to get to their ends and stuff. *44:06* And I I like the fusion thing. *44:13* Yeah, I don't necessarily like I don't like how DNA splicers are just like a thing suddenly. *44:15* It's like, ah, well let's just steal these really quick. *44:21* Yeah, I feel like it should have been a uh more like a natural thing between the Pokemon, like when they clash, they mesh or something like that. *44:24* Yeah, or like maybe we learn across the course of our journey about the history of Unova and these these *44:32* legendary dragons, instead of just mentioning them, we learn about their their plight. *44:38* And maybe it's like, ah, someone thinks they saw a black dragon over here with a green-haired boy. *44:42* And like maybe you're che I don't know. *44:48* It's just *44:50* There's so much potential to expand upon this lore. *44:51* And I wish they did, because there's some cool stuff. *44:55* The fusion is dope. *44:57* The fusion is really dope. *44:58* I mean this can lead us into talking about the gameplay elements, but I feel like the reason the DNA splicers are even a thing is for a gameplay purpose rather than a story purpose. *45:00* And that's because when you capture *45:08* uh Kairim or and then pair it with one of the others, you use the DNA splicers as a key item to either fuse them together or separate them. *45:10* Separate them. *45:19* So it's kind of serves that purpose for the player to fuse them together if you so choose once you get them. *45:20* Um *45:28* But also, yes, it's kind of it's kind of strange at the same time, just like, here I'm gonna toss this DNA splicer into the sky and oh no, now we're now they're combined. *45:29* Oh shot. *45:39* Chairo's really cool. *45:42* I mean we we can we have this jotted down, but some of the movies in this game I think are neat. *45:45* Um this is the one of the first games where I think they really do this is use the *45:50* 3D animated cutscenes. *45:54* Like they do it. *45:56* They only do it a couple times. *45:57* They only do it a few times. *45:59* They do it once when the uh the town gets frozen up, and then they do it in another instance with the battle between *46:00* Kitrem and the other legendary Zekramer. *46:07* Reshiram. *46:10* Um but *46:12* Oh, you're talking about other movies. *46:14* We'll get into that in a second. *46:16* But yes, the animated cutscenes I think are are cool. *46:18* They're very cool. *46:21* They're very uh *46:22* Cinematic in a way. *46:25* I you could tell they're very much inspired like even like how the music is kind of set during those sequences. *46:26* I it's like major Godzilla vibes in these fights. *46:31* So it is cool. *46:36* The uh I like the concept of an ice dragon as well as the legendary. *46:38* That's one of those cool pairings that's like, ah, this kind of breaks the rules a little bit. *46:45* That's neat. *46:49* And I like that you can't catch it the first time because you could just throw a master ball and finish it. *46:50* So I I like that you actually had to fight it all the way. *46:55* I kind of like that, but I also kind of hate it because *46:58* It's kind of easy to to defeat and then it's just gone. *47:03* It goes and then you that screen goes. *47:06* In like Pokemon Sword and Sword Shield, it was you had to beat it and then you could catch it after you beat it. *47:09* Yes. *47:14* So that you know, they they at least would go on to fix that type of mistake later, but it's uh it's cool that they make you fight Kyrium or whatever it's called when it's fused. *47:15* Talk about the movies. *47:27* That's okay. *47:32* Yes, now you can create actual Pokemon films in these games, which is *47:38* I I don't know. *47:45* It it it's it's a thing. *47:45* I mean they always put little secondary things in these games to just kind of fill them out. *47:47* I mean these are games for kids and like I'm sure kids I'm just mad that they make you take thirty minutes to do this *47:52* Yes, that is always the big fault. *47:59* The theater thing wasn't. *48:02* It was just like, oh, here's them theater. *48:03* Why don't you go on a play? *48:06* And then you just turn around and leave. *48:08* Yes. *48:10* With the movies, I mean the good thing is is that the movie studio is ran by a Mr. *48:11* Stu Dio, which I really liked. *48:16* It's a good name. *48:19* It's a very, very good name. *48:20* And so that I *48:22* I think that's I I broadly speaking, the movie part of this game, it's it's annoying that you have to play through it. *48:24* I think it's how it functions is *48:30* As far as like the other secondary things that they've added in the Pokemon series over the years, I think this one is one of the better ones. *48:34* I would *48:41* guess. *48:42* Like it's not amazing and I'm not gonna spend extra time doing it outside of the tutorial section where they force you to. *48:42* But I would prefer to do that sort of thing than *48:49* beauty contests or something like that. *48:52* You know? *48:54* That's fair. *48:54* You're at least there's gameplay tied to it where you actually do a Pokemon battle follow a script. *48:55* Yes. *49:00* And then, you know, it's almost like a sp you have to fight a certain way, which is interesting. *49:00* Yes. *49:05* I like I like I like that. *49:05* Forcing you to do it *49:08* for like half an hour is not fun. *49:10* It kills kills the pace. *49:13* Yes. *49:15* I I agree with you *49:16* Other than that, I mean, a lot of the other gameplay things I feel like are recycled from the other games. *49:17* You've got rotation battles back, triple battles are back. *49:22* Is there anything else in these gameplay-wise that was really *49:25* drastically changed or different this time around. *49:28* You actually gain experience at an acceptable rate. *49:33* Oh yes, this is true. *49:36* You do gain so much better. *49:38* I way enjoyed my time leveling up in this game. *49:41* I feel like part of it is because they put higher level Pokemon in front of you, and so you're gaining experience at a better rate because *49:45* The Pokemon you f are facing are actually kind of beefy throughout the game. *49:53* Like I felt like I was leveling at a decent rate and I would still run into trainers and they had Pokemon three or four levels higher than me. *49:57* And I was like, oh darn. *50:03* Jeez. *50:05* And so there is like an inherent challenge there, but it also ensures that the experience you're gaining constantly is of a higher rate and you get to the end of the game. *50:05* It does feel this is I will say this is absolutely one of the better *50:14* leveling like mm grinds in the entire series, I think. *50:19* It feels uh ex like the right level of a little grind, a little challenge, but you're never s at such a deficit of *50:24* Ugh, I'm six levels behind and it's just like a struggle to do that. *50:33* I gotta go into Vict I gotta go into Victory Road and grind for the next forty minutes to train my Pokemon up, and then I'll go back to the Elite Four and try to face them again. *50:37* Yeah, nothing like that ever happens *50:45* But everything still feels like there is an a a difficulty or a challenge to it, which is something that absolutely starts to fade in the series. *50:47* From here on out, really, I feel like with X and Y, it starts to r absolutely become way too cupcake easy, and then they start to fix that a little bit more later on. *50:57* But *51:07* Um yeah, I the it what's funny about that is like we're saying they found a perfect balance here finally and a great balance here with these games, and then they go on to totally just toss it out there with no XP share for everybody. *51:08* It's like no *51:20* You did it well here. *51:22* Keep this keep this keep this in line for all of the future games. *51:23* And then they just absolutely don't do it. *51:28* It really did feel like kind of this perfect balance of gameplay. *51:31* Like Pokemon had kind of like perfected the formula right here as far as battles and gameplay go. *51:34* Um they still have the gimmick of like a rotation battle, but there's double and triple battles, which are interesting strategically on their own. *51:40* The the battles themselves are snappy, you know, status effects, different moves. *51:46* They're animated beautifully, but they don't take too long. *51:50* The health bar moves at a good rate. *51:53* Like everything feels balanced here in this game. *51:55* And *52:00* then it then it goes to not balanced kind of from here on out, and which is such a bummer. *52:01* But I am really glad because that was like my big issue with black *52:07* And whiteiness of it. *52:11* Kind of that pacing angle of the game. *52:16* And I almost it's I I wish we could merge the two. *52:18* It's almost take the *52:21* Like a twin snake situation. *52:23* Take the the story and stuff from the first game, we'll put the gameplay of the second game in it. *52:24* And that honestly may be a fan mod out there. *52:29* I don't even know, but sounds like something the Pokemon community would do. *52:32* It was a really fun game to play this time around. *52:36* It was really great to build my team, level up. *52:39* It just felt good all around. *52:43* And I liked *52:45* having Pokemon from the previous generations show up this time around, while it may not have been necessarily explained narratively, like why all of a sudden there were 300 more Pokemon. *52:47* It was cool to see *52:59* them come back in a in a cool way without it being such a drawn out thing of, oh my gosh, there's a a Johto Pokemon over there. *53:01* It was just like, nah, here's a here's an electric sheep. *53:10* I feel like they still put the Unova region Pokemon front and center more than anything else. *53:13* Like they don't ever. *53:18* I mean, I I think that's always been my annoyance with some of these other games where they do expand the decks outside of *53:20* And a little bit more in the expanded versions like, you know, Platinum, Emerald, so on. *53:25* Is that some of the new Pokemon that they do introduce kind of end up taking the spotlight away from the ones that were originally there, and I don't feel like that's the case this time around. *53:30* I feel like *53:39* If anything, they make it easier to get some of the other ones. *53:40* Like I think of uh whatever the uh the first evolution of Electros is. *53:43* I think that's a little bit easier to catch in this game this time around. *53:49* Yeah, I think that's a little bit easier to catch. *53:53* Like the catch rates for that in Charge Stone Cave were a little bit improved this time around. *53:54* And so So that's nice. *53:58* Yeah, they tweak they tweak when things show up, level up, and and things like that. *54:01* It's all *54:05* Good and acceptable. *54:06* It's not a good thing. *54:07* I mean what's Yeah, it's to really not I I feel like we've been very negative this episode on this game, but I do want to stress like *54:08* Kind of like we were saying. *54:15* Gameplay wise, I do think these are some of the best Pokemon games in the entire series, both black and white two and black and white one. *54:16* Like *54:23* I think these are some of the best. *54:24* I love these DEXs. *54:26* I love all the Pokemon. *54:27* I love the Pokemon they add into the Dex in this game. *54:28* Anytime you put Growlithe and Arcanine into a dex and allow me to catch it easily, I'm gonna love that. *54:31* Um so I I really do think like gameplay-wise, these are absolutely some of the best. *54:36* We're just not talking about that a lot because I feel like we got into the intricacies of that. *54:43* In our first episode, and there's not a whole lot left to say this time around. *54:47* So if you want to hear us expand more on those thoughts and you haven't listened to our *54:51* First episode on just black and white, you can go back and listen to that and we'll dive into that a bit more. *54:55* The last thing on like a gameplay element that I wanted to bring up though. *55:00* Um was something we talked about before the show? *55:04* Okay, good. *55:07* I was gonna make sure we brought this up too. *55:08* Because like *55:10* Black and white wine are so good about like basically not making you have to use HMs at all. *55:11* In fact, I don't think you have to peri period. *55:16* Even even surf, even surf is not needed in those games, to my knowledge. *55:19* You can get from *55:24* the starting town to the Elite Four without ever giving one of your Pokemon an HM, which is great. *55:25* And that's how I think it should be. *55:31* And obviously the series later on started to move away from HMs and any sort of traversal methods you needed, it would just give you naturally *55:33* I think of like sword and shield and stuff like that where everything was like tied to your bike or whatever. *55:40* Um Hunchgrow would come pick you up. *55:44* Sure. *55:46* Taxis. *55:47* Things like that. *55:47* That is not the case in this game. *55:48* It's very annoying. *55:50* They don't go they don't go close. *55:51* They are so close. *55:53* Like you get to the you get to Victory Road. *55:54* You need surf. *55:57* Which is, I don't think, a huge deal because if there's one HM I don't think people have a problem with, it is Surf because I feel like every every team you're ever gonna fly, I think. *55:58* Yeah. *56:06* Surf is the one that I think everybody always gets regardless to some degree. *56:07* So that's fine. *56:12* It's a good move to have in general. *56:13* Yes. *56:14* The problem is you get to the victory road and then all of a sudden you need strength as well. *56:15* Which is like one time. *56:20* You just need strength once. *56:22* Yes. *56:23* I I actually on Victory Road I just took two of my team out and put in uh two low level Pokemon that had strength and *56:24* Fly and surf on them. *56:33* There's always the classic you go you go the HM slave route and you just go get a Pokemon that can learn all sorts of HMs and you run through Victory Road with them or whatever. *56:34* I mean I've done that plenty of times, but it is very annoying that the first games got it right, and then in this game for some reason they just *56:43* Hardlock you at Victory Road and they're like, nope, we're gonna make you need strength this one time to advance. *56:51* And I don't know why they do that. *56:56* It's such a weird thing. *56:58* Yes, yes, you still have to go to a move deleter to make that change. *57:02* The later games have gotten so much got so much better with that stuff. *57:07* Like again *57:10* Uh like Scarlet and Violet where you can just m manage your menu. *57:11* Just do it in the menu, on the fly, anywhere in the world. *57:15* It's fantastic. *57:18* It's awesome. *57:19* I love those that about the later games. *57:20* Yeah, it's it was such a bummer. *57:23* Always I I'm in the habit of what HMs do I need to get through Victory Road? *57:26* And when I read this time that I needed strength, I was like *57:30* I did I did the same thing because I ran into the boulder. *57:33* So close. *57:36* I ran into the boulder at Victory Road and I was like, wait a minute. *57:37* There's no way they're gonna make me have to learn strength right now. *57:40* They've gone almost two full games without having to make me *57:43* learn a specific HM, you know, other than surf, which I'm already teaching my Pokemon. *57:47* I'm like, there's no way they're gonna make me do this. *57:52* And I look it up and alas, there it is. *57:54* You do need strength. *57:57* It's like, oh, this sucks. *57:58* So very annoying, very frustrating. *57:59* Not a fan of that decision. *58:03* I don't know why they did that, but *58:04* Whatever. *58:07* Yeah, whatever indeed. *58:08* Music again, a lot of commonality between the two games. *58:10* I think there are some new tracks here this time around. *58:14* Uh specifically the battle theme, I know you noted was a lot better this time with the the rival battle theme. *58:17* I think slightly better. *58:23* Slightly better. *58:25* Yes. *58:26* Like it it but you know what was a regression was I think the Team Plasma battle theme. *58:26* I think they Uh-huh. *58:32* Um a lot of the a lot of the teams from the first game do return though, so again there's not Yeah. *58:37* The wild battle and trainer battles are the same. *58:43* I did note that the uh the Geddis theme is better this time around. *58:47* I had a big problem with that last time, so that that was a bit more fitting. *58:52* But the champion theme was a bit lackluster this time around. *58:55* So it's like ah we can't all *58:58* Can't all win here. *59:01* But some that I wrote down, um, you know, I like the first town, Asperta City. *59:02* I thought that was really sweet. *59:08* I liked Undela Town a lot. *59:09* Um, and these could be the same from the first game, I'm just noticing them more here in the second one, but Undellatown's beachy Animal Crossing vibe was *59:11* was good. *59:19* And I liked Route 13, which is right after Indella Town. *59:19* It was kind of all pair nicely. *59:22* And I really liked the cave theme. *59:24* I the cave theme's really good me this time. *59:25* Yeah. *59:29* Um, I mean a lot again, a lot of them all of the music that does return to is like remixed or revamped in some sort of ways, like you mentioned that gets his theme. *59:30* Uh the end battle music you can face him again and that's a little bit different this time around too *59:38* Same sort same melodies, same broad beats, but they do some different things with the the instrumentation that is being applied in those tracks and it makes it feel *59:43* Like even though some of the song a lot of the songs do return, they still feel fresh, which I appreciate. *59:54* Um, because I really feel like they could have just, you know *59:59* included all the same songs and not done a whole lot with them. *01:00:03* But the the attention to detail that has always been made with the Pokemon series when it comes to music, I feel like is top-notch. *01:00:06* And that really doesn't *01:00:12* That doesn't that doesn't prove to be any different in this time around with with these games and I and I appreciate that. *01:00:14* We've also got Jada down here post-game. *01:00:20* I know me both you and I didn't really do anything post-game this time around. *01:00:22* Um *01:00:26* There is a lot to do. *01:00:27* I mean, we talked about the new areas to explore and um oh that was one thing I wanted to mention to you. *01:00:28* How do you feel about them putting the *01:00:33* three legendary Pokemon from the region in front of you as you play through the game. *01:00:36* And they're like, you should catch these because they'll help you fight Team Plasma. *01:00:42* That's a much different thing than they've ever done in the games previously. *01:00:46* I didn't catch a single one of them. *01:00:51* Did you just kill them all? *01:00:54* Yeah, I tried to catch them, but they kept breaking out of the Pokeball and I'm like, oh I'm just gonna move them along here. *01:00:55* They definitely have very high uh *01:01:01* Cat rates for sure. *01:01:04* Yeah. *01:01:06* They're cool. *01:01:07* I they're not uh they're not my favorite design. *01:01:08* It's Verizion or Verizion, Cobalion. *01:01:12* Yeah, Verizon. *01:01:16* Verizon, T Mobile, and ATT my favorite legendary Pokemon. *01:01:17* And then Terrakion. *01:01:20* Um again, like *01:01:22* I didn't catch them either, for what it's worth. *01:01:24* But I again it's more just the idea that they put them in front of you and they're like, hey, you should you should get these. *01:01:26* It it would be worth your time to go capture them. *01:01:32* Um I I think that's a cool sort of idea. *01:01:35* Also, um in these games, I mean we didn't again didn't toy around with the *01:01:38* post-game too much, but uh Landorus, Thunderous, and uh Tornadus, don't they have their different forms in these games as well? *01:01:44* You know what I'm talking about? *01:01:53* I believe so. *01:01:54* I'm not sure what I'm saying. *01:01:55* That's where they introduce the different forms, I think, is in these games. *01:01:56* I want to catch them. *01:02:01* They are ones that I want to let go at. *01:02:02* Those are vi those are the those are that's the cool threesome to have in this game. *01:02:04* And there's two different uh threesets of Pokemon. *01:02:08* And those are definitely the *01:02:12* But I know Thunderous is like big and competitive. *01:02:15* Um not in our series for members. *01:02:19* It's still I've hear they're pretty *01:02:23* pretty powerful in the competitive scene, at least they were. *01:02:25* And and we haven't talked about it either, but like I think the legendaries overall in this deck are quite cool. *01:02:28* Um like Keldeo being a water fighting type is cool. *01:02:34* Um, and then we've got Meloetta, which is like a musical note sort of legendary Pokemon, which is weird. *01:02:38* Genesect is really cool. *01:02:44* I love how Genesect's design. *01:02:46* Um and Genesect was like a *01:02:48* Uh, there was some sort of like promotional thing that you got with the game when you originally got black and white too for Genesec. *01:02:51* There was a way to get. *01:02:58* him so I was I was looking this up. *01:02:59* You can still get these Pokemon, these event Pokemon, because they're registered to like an IP address or something. *01:03:01* So like *01:03:09* You can just t set up a IP and it it will come in as legitimate because it's coming from these websites or whatever. *01:03:09* You're not cheating or hacking or *01:03:16* So I kind of want toys argue promotional event or whatever. *01:03:17* Yeah. *01:03:21* So like you can go back and get some of these, which I think is really neat. *01:03:21* And I kind of want to do that to get, you know, the Genesect and Kaleido and stuff. *01:03:25* Just *01:03:29* to have them when we do the great migration, 'cause you and I both here at the end of the season get to finally do our big Pokebank migration into Pokemon Home. *01:03:30* That might be my big project over the over Christmas here. *01:03:40* I'll have to be at home with my at home with my uh my girlfriend and my parents up and be like, what are you doing? *01:03:44* I'll be like, I'm mass transferring Pokemon from across nine different game games to the Pokemon bank. *01:03:51* I got this Pokemon 15 years ago. *01:03:57* Now it's gonna be safe in the cloud. *01:04:01* Yes. *01:04:04* So that'll be the fun part. *01:04:05* I've been very much looking forward to that here. *01:04:06* at the end of our season. *01:04:09* But yeah, I I want to call out some of those other legendaries because again, I know we historically haven't done a whole lot of post-game stuff throughout the course of this season. *01:04:10* I think the most we did was was gold, our gold souls. *01:04:18* Golden Soul yeah, Hargold and SoulSilver, but that was just because it had to be red. *01:04:21* We had to be red. *01:04:26* That's that's the rule with those games. *01:04:27* So yeah, but uh there's a there there's a lot of good post-game stuff in these. *01:04:30* I I remember from back in the day. *01:04:33* I definitely played black and white one. *01:04:35* A whole bunch. *01:04:38* We're gonna have a two-part discussion here to wrap up uh this episode. *01:04:39* Just like these two games. *01:04:44* Yes, just like these two games. *01:04:46* First first part, I mean, what do you think *01:04:47* Again, the legacy of the black and white too. *01:04:51* What are the legacies of the is game in your mind? *01:04:53* And I feel like this is a very *01:04:56* Sort of obvious one in some sense. *01:04:58* The only direct sequels. *01:05:01* The only direct sequels if we're not counting, you know, gold and silver as direct sequels, which they kind of are, but *01:05:02* Aren't a name, you know. *01:05:09* These are the only Pokemon games that have a only mainline Pokemon games that have a number in their titles. *01:05:10* I don't think they'll ever do that again either. *01:05:18* They could. *01:05:20* I just don't think they'll do it again. *01:05:23* Yeah. *01:05:25* I mean I that is the big thing with these games. *01:05:25* And I'm curious *01:05:29* I mean to maybe broaden this discussion out a bit about like what these the legacy of these games is. *01:05:31* Like obviously we're in an era where remakes have been rife and have these are next are next. *01:05:37* These are next on tap, but *01:05:44* Given that there are sequels, I wonder how they would handle remakes. *01:05:46* Would it just be the first games? *01:05:49* I feel like they would just do the first games and then they'll do black and white. *01:05:51* to. *01:05:54* Yeah, but you know that it would be a same sort of situation like with uh what's happening with Persona right now with a Persona 3 remake they're doing, everybody's like, why aren't you remaking the Persona 3 Fez content? *01:05:55* Why aren't you *01:06:06* adding the female protagonist from Persona 3 Portable. *01:06:07* It's like there is extra stuff here, and I feel like no one's gonna be fully happy if they don't do like a comprehensive remake of like *01:06:10* everything in some sense. *01:06:18* And so I d would wonder what Game Freak would do. *01:06:19* I do agree they would probably just remake the first games. *01:06:22* They could do what they do here at the end of this game. *01:06:25* After credits roll, you unlock something called challenge mode, which is a harder difficulty mode. *01:06:28* Maybe once you beat base black and white, you unlock the black and white 2 story content, and it's a tougher challenge. *01:06:33* Almost new game plus in a way. *01:06:41* I don't know if your team would carry over with you, but *01:06:42* or whatever, but you kind of can you move forward and you get to go through how the world has changed in the two years more directly instead of waiting *01:06:45* three years for the next remake and you know, and it's a different art style and they don't feel conjugant. *01:06:54* Cause whatever art style they do for black and white *01:07:00* remake, which I can't imagine is going to be the same as Diamond and Pearl. *01:07:03* Please don't do the chibi style Diamond and Pearl stuff. *01:07:07* Not a huge fan of that. *01:07:09* I think it fit those games, but I don't want to see it again. *01:07:11* Yeah *01:07:13* So it's an interesting problem. *01:07:14* Maybe they do put 'em together. *01:07:17* Um c obviously it's not a lot of narrative different content *01:07:19* Um they would have to unify the gameplay front across both though, and I would hope it'd be more in line with two than one. *01:07:22* But well, I wonder if the even if they stuck to the story of the first games, I wonder if they would then, you know. *01:07:28* Well, like, let's add the opening area from Black and White 2, like that southwestern region where you start your journey this time around, and where the first two gems are. *01:07:34* Like maybe they could add those into the game as like a *01:07:42* postgame area of some sort that you could go to and there's different types of Pokemon and different legendaries. *01:07:46* I I don't know. *01:07:51* Like there's a way where I think they could kind of *01:07:51* Do everything that has been seen across both of these games. *01:07:55* Tell only one of the stories. *01:07:58* I think the first story is the one you tell. *01:08:00* Obviously. *01:08:03* You have to pick one. *01:08:04* Well, obviously, I mean that's the one they're gonna do, but I I guess and you really can't tick do this story unless there's a time gap. *01:08:05* So *01:08:12* You kind of have to just do the story of the first one, I feel like, and just leave it at that. *01:08:13* But you could add again the different gameplay elements we've talked about, add some of the different locales. *01:08:17* Add that opening area from Black and White to the opening first set of like what two or three towns before you get to the middle portion of the map or the mainland portion of Unova. *01:08:22* Um, I feel like they could do that in a remake and that would be interesting. *01:08:33* Yeah. *01:08:37* Other than that though, like I really don't feel like I mean this is like our most like basic legacy discussion. *01:08:37* Like *01:08:43* The legacy of these games is just they were the sequels and they're the last Nintendo DS games. *01:08:43* But even that doesn't really *01:08:48* like hold a ton of weight because 3DS is still DS in some sort of way and there wasn't a monumental jump from entry. *01:08:51* Yes, yes. *01:09:02* Probably how most *01:09:03* Maybe most well, the 3DS I think was still $250 at the time, so maybe not. *01:09:04* You know, I'm looking here on the Wikipedia, it says total sales for these games seven point eight million worldwide. *01:09:09* Explain to the Which is not a lot for a Pokemon game, to be honest. *01:09:15* Especially if you look at like Sword and Shield. *01:09:20* Sorry, that was as of January 2013. *01:09:22* So that may not be final sales. *01:09:24* Well, I mean they probably *01:09:26* Didn't do I mean let's say there's give or take ten million out there. *01:09:28* So these are definitely I think the second most expensive *01:09:32* I mean well, I guess third if you throw emerald into the mix alone. *01:09:36* Emerald's like two yeah, two hundred bucks. *01:09:40* These are like hundred and fifty complete. *01:09:41* Yeah. *01:09:43* I mean obviously the complete Game Boy games are always more expensive because no so many people threw out the cardboard stuff. *01:09:44* Like hard gold, soul silver at the top, and anyway, these are some of the most expensive. *01:09:51* And I think *01:09:56* maybe the most forgotten because of that sequel. *01:09:57* I don't I don't remember the conversation really around in 2012. *01:10:00* completely, but I I do remember a few friends being like, they're making a sequel instead of just like gray or whatever. *01:10:06* Like I I remember some consternation there around *01:10:11* Oh, now they're just milking it for two versions. *01:10:16* So if you want everything, you have to buy two extra versions of the game instead of just the one. *01:10:18* It's so it's *01:10:23* I don't know how well that has been received in hindsight, so I guess we'll see what they do when they do remake it, if they remake them together or separately. *01:10:26* There's the chance to do gray. *01:10:35* Can do gray now? *01:10:37* Always go back and just re make up a game that never existed. *01:10:38* Yeah. *01:10:42* And so for part two of our sort of legacy discussion here, obviously we usually end episodes talking about the legacy of a single game, but this is our final episode of the season, at least for *01:10:43* For now, we'll probably obviously come back and add new episodes to this season as new Pokemon games come out because obviously that will continue forever. *01:10:53* There's gonna be a new Pokemon game? *01:11:02* I mean *01:11:03* Really quick, maybe to kind of bridge these two, the new DLC for Scarlet and Violet just came out and is in the Unova region. *01:11:05* It is actually, yeah. *01:11:12* Which I've I've *01:11:14* Kind of I really wanna play it. *01:11:15* I really wanna play. *01:11:17* I have this very cool. *01:11:18* I've purchased the DLC. *01:11:19* I have not played it. *01:11:20* I've been tabling some of the stuff *01:11:21* some of the newer stuff. *01:11:23* Like you know I have not played Arceus yet. *01:11:24* You need to. *01:11:27* So I'm gonna play that now. *01:11:28* I I figured that would be a nice little *01:11:29* carrot on the end of the stick here for me once we got through all of these games to go back and play Arceus now. *01:11:31* I fe I feel like that'll be fun. *01:11:37* And then the DLC for Scarlet and Violet. *01:11:39* And I feel like the DLC for Scarlet and Violet is a good time to go back to those games because that's where we're going to have our *01:11:41* Ultimate Pokebattle as well. *01:11:46* Ultimate Pokebattle. *01:11:48* We're gonna have them in the latest entries in the series, which I don't know if that's a *01:11:50* Good or a bad idea, but so be it. *01:11:54* See how it goes. *01:11:57* Um But yeah, I mean this is I mean we mentioned it at the top. *01:11:58* This has been our lar largest undertaking to date *01:12:02* Um played through every single game in the series in some capacity now. *01:12:06* Obviously not some of the older games where remakes were *01:12:12* Available. *01:12:15* We played through those. *01:12:15* I mean, there's still a lot of Pokemon blind spots, I guess, in that sense that we might have uh here, but *01:12:16* We can now speak definitively to this whole series and I guess just broadly, Max, for you like coming into this, you had obviously not played *01:12:25* Far more games in this series than myself. *01:12:34* I had only, you know, not played I think like three of the mainline entries. *01:12:36* It was Sun and Moon, Sword and Shield, and then obviously *01:12:41* Scarlet and Violet came out as we were doing this. *01:12:45* So I had I had a far more comprehensive look at the series compared to yourself. *01:12:49* How do you feel having now played everything? *01:12:56* What do you think of the series overall? *01:12:58* Just broadly where are you at *01:13:00* I was I've told you earlier, I may have even said it in this show. *01:13:04* I don't remember if it was pre or post starting, but you know, we started playing in April or so of twenty-two. *01:13:07* And I at that time I had only played *01:13:14* Uh two Pokemon games really. *01:13:17* And I came to find out I'd really played a lot of X as well. *01:13:19* Um, you know, seven badges deep, but say three games, let's be generous. *01:13:23* Uh you know, blue, diamond, and X. *01:13:28* But I had I couldn't tell you the type chart. *01:13:31* I like only really knew the Canto Pokemon. *01:13:35* My my knowledge of Pokemon was very *01:13:38* Empty. *01:13:41* Total novice. *01:13:42* And now, I mean, I'm out here building hyper-focused teams. *01:13:44* I've got this type chart pretty much down. *01:13:48* I *01:13:51* I feel like I understand the people that say generations are mechanics and not decks Pokemon. *01:13:53* They're still wrong, but the I understand their argument a bit more now. *01:14:00* It's cool to say that I have finally played all the mainline Pokemon games. *01:14:06* I can actually speak to every generation of Pokemon, which has been a *01:14:10* a franchise that is a constant in my life. *01:14:15* And now I have a touch point for how the series has evolved, where it's going, what I'd like to see from it. *01:14:18* You know, I have played Arceus. *01:14:25* And Scarlet and Violet, and like that is a direction the T the these mainline games need to keep going in is open exploratory cat *01:14:28* I mean, dude, when you play Arceus, it's so it is exactly where I want Pokemon to keep going. *01:14:36* I would love. *01:14:42* Really, we should maybe they should do a Legends, you know. *01:14:43* Genesect or something. *01:14:47* I don't know. *01:14:48* Just a legends Unova type game. *01:14:49* I think that would actually be really dope with all the lore here with Yenova and the twins and the splitting of the dragons. *01:14:51* Like it would be really cool to see Yenova come together that way, but *01:14:58* It is a series that is kind of it's reaching a new form, but it also needs to tighten up its graphics on level three, so to speak. *01:15:01* You know, these are still the best looking Pokemon games that we've played all season. *01:15:11* Black and White 2 specifically. *01:15:16* And it's a shame that these games run in such a poor state nowadays. *01:15:18* And um *01:15:23* I really want to see Game Freak kind of bring that up to match the gameplay promise. *01:15:24* Because Scarlet and Violet are still fun to play, even if though they look atrocious and run like hot garbage. *01:15:29* So it's there's still room for improvement. *01:15:35* You know, I think the stories are getting better. *01:15:38* I m maybe we can m come back to black and white in a more mature way going forward, but *01:15:40* I'm glad that we did it, and I don't think I would have done this without the show. *01:15:46* I don't think I ever really would have gone back and played a game like Sun and Moon or X and Y. *01:15:50* Yeah, you know, I probably wouldn't have played Alpha Sapphire Omega Ruby, I probably would have played the Game Boy version instead. *01:15:56* But I I can speak to this *01:16:01* Whole series a lot better, I think, which I find valuable. *01:16:04* I don't what about you coming back after a lifetime of Pokemon? *01:16:08* You know, this is the first time revisiting some of these games, I think. *01:16:12* Well, f to I mean first off to go off of what you said, like yes, I imagine this is like I knew this coming into this season that like this would be cool for you to do because this is like *01:16:15* I mean, I we would have to double check, but I'm I'm pretty sure in Pokemon is like the largest media property on the planet. *01:16:24* Yeah. *01:16:30* Like just overall comprehensive sales for everything. *01:16:30* Obviously, they're not the *01:16:33* high-selling video games ever alone. *01:16:34* Um, or maybe I I don't know. *01:16:36* They're up there. *01:16:38* This is like one of the biggest media properties in existence across the anime, the merch, the *01:16:39* the games, it just everything. *01:16:45* So yes, it is cool that you can now speak to it all. *01:16:47* It's the highest grossing media franchise. *01:16:51* Yeah, okay. *01:16:54* I thought so. *01:16:55* F eighty-eight billion dollars. *01:16:56* You know who's behind it? *01:16:58* Mickey Mouse at fifty-two billion. *01:17:00* Yeah. *01:17:02* Like *01:17:02* Yeah, Pikachu's got Mickey Mouse beat all day. *01:17:05* And now you can speak to all of this. *01:17:07* And so I figured that would be a cool thing for you. *01:17:09* I mean, obviously you weren't *01:17:12* Blind to Pokemon by any means, but like it's cool that you can now talk about the whole series and how has it it has evolved, pun intended, and just grown over the years. *01:17:14* Um *01:17:24* As for myself, the biggest takeaway I have from this season is that, dude, these games are just still like. *01:17:25* Like I I I like I don't I don't know how you feel now at the end of this and maybe you're just Pokemoned out and you're wanting to take a massive break, but like *01:17:34* These are like comfort food games for me. *01:17:42* Like there is a there is a structure to all of them that is *01:17:45* Very similar and very I it very they have not in it in some ways this is still very much the same games that originally launched back in the nineties. *01:17:50* And I love that. *01:17:59* Like they have not really *01:18:00* What they are what the games are today with Scarlet and Violet is very much still at a baseline level what it was when they was first introduced over 25 years ago. *01:18:01* And so going through all of these games and playing all of them, yes, they have different stories and different Pokemon and little different gameplay mechanics here and there, but just the act of *01:18:11* Choosing the Pokemon you want, capturing them, building them up, leveling them up with you over the course of a journey is still so fun to me. *01:18:20* And I have loved going back to these games. *01:18:28* And, you know, the thing I've tried to do throughout all of these games is like pick different Pokemon that I haven't picked before, but I've always wanted to build teams around. *01:18:31* That has been fun for me. *01:18:39* Um, because I I've played through so many of these games so many times, but there's still like Pokemon. *01:18:41* The the DEXs are so comprehensive and you can only ever choose six that like if they introduce a hundred or a hundred and fifty Pokemon, like you're still putting *01:18:46* Dozens and dozens of Pokemon on the shelf that you've never built a team with or played with. *01:18:55* And so I've really loved building teams around new Pokemon that I've never used in the past. *01:18:59* That's been a ton of fun for me. *01:19:04* Just yeah, like again, like after this season, I am still going to be playing Pokemon games. *01:19:06* Like I have just really fallen back in love with this series. *01:19:11* I've had ups and downs with the Pokemon series over the years. *01:19:15* Not in the sense that like *01:19:18* Like I know in the wake of like Diamond and Pearl and Black and White, I was like, ah, I don't think I'll play Pokemon anymore. *01:19:19* That's kind of like a kid's thing. *01:19:25* And then I like the game for *01:19:26* babies. *01:19:28* And then I sold them all off to GameStop and I'm like, wait, what the heck am I doing? *01:19:28* And then I jump back in and then um *01:19:32* You know, then I kind of got burned for a bit by like the direction that things were going with X and Y, and that made me not want to play Sun and Moon or *01:19:36* X or uh sword and shield and stuff like that. *01:19:44* And so but then when I get back and I go play those games, I'm like, oh these games are great. *01:19:46* Why didn't I play these before? *01:19:50* You know? *01:19:51* And so *01:19:51* I I guess, broadly speaking, just like I've loved Pokemon since I've been four or five years old. *01:19:54* I still love Pokemon now. *01:19:59* I'm still going to be playing Pokemon after we're done with this season. *01:20:01* I'm going to *01:20:04* Fine tune some things with black and white too, set that aside, we'll have our battle and then I'm gonna start booting up Arceus or Arceus here in the coming *01:20:05* Coming weeks, I'm gonna play through that. *01:20:13* I'm gonna play through the Scarlet and Violet DLC. *01:20:14* I'm gonna start trying to transfer everything over and get it all in my bank. *01:20:16* Like, I don't see this ending anytime soon. *01:20:19* And I love that. *01:20:22* And it feels *01:20:23* What's great is like this feels like and this will really come to light I think once we start transferring everything, but just that having everything now *01:20:25* be at the point where it can transfer to the future games is going to be so fun. *01:20:34* I'm so excited and looking forward to like you're getting my kid like *01:20:39* I caught that Pokemon on this cartridge. *01:20:43* Hey, this is my this this is my Hound Doom that clutch clutched out a W against Max and gosh. *01:20:45* I watched it video. *01:20:51* I keep watching it and I'm telling you, man. *01:20:53* Mistakes were made. *01:20:58* So like I'm I'm I just yeah. *01:20:59* I I I love that it feels like all these journeys I've had with the different Pokemon is are gonna still come forward with me. *01:21:01* And like, yeah, who's to say I won't go back and be like, you know, I'm in the mood to replay uh s uh sapphire or Ruby now. *01:21:08* Like maybe I'll do that, you know. *01:21:17* Like I've got all these games. *01:21:18* I've purchased them over the course of our season. *01:21:20* I've been in the pokey zone here. *01:21:22* I don't have the GBA games in back, but uh everything DS and forward I've now bought physically and I have *01:21:23* I even bought the Let's Go games. *01:21:29* Like I've thought about those. *01:21:31* Like, I never really played Let's Go, Pikachu, or Eevee all the way through. *01:21:32* Maybe I'll do that, you know. *01:21:35* Try those out, dabble with those. *01:21:36* And so it's just like *01:21:38* Yeah, I don't know. *01:21:40* Like, it's just reminded me that Pokemons for all ages, I uh I I'm going to continue playing these games until I'm probably an old man. *01:21:41* There's a comfort to them for me and yeah. *01:21:52* Long live Pokemon. *01:21:56* But yes, Game Freak, please, please tighten up the graphics on level three and do a little bit better. *01:21:57* I I will keep playing Pokemon. *01:22:03* I definitely won't miss new games from here on out. *01:22:05* Like I have, you know, my whole life up to this point, but *01:22:08* Uh I've also really come to terms that I'm just not a portable handheld player anymore. *01:22:11* Oh, dude, this has opened my eyes to that I am. *01:22:16* Like this is why I've been wanting this. *01:22:20* Like I am totally into handhelds again. *01:22:23* Like that's the other thing that this season has done. *01:22:26* It's done the total opposite for me. *01:22:29* I really realize that I don't want to play *01:22:31* in a little device in my hands anymore. *01:22:33* I want to see things on my TV and play them on the big screen and have dedicated time. *01:22:35* So that's been an interesting kind of lesson over the last 20 months that I've really realized. *01:22:40* And I I'm yeah, I do need a break for a bit. *01:22:45* Like we'll we'll finish our battles up and stuff, but I I'm a little Pokemon down. *01:22:48* I'm a little RPG doubt. *01:22:53* Like I just need some time to refresh and play some different things and I think Castlevania and Metroid Prime will will definitely help with that 'cause it's a good thing. *01:22:55* And then it will be Metroidvania out at the end of this coming season. *01:23:03* Uh yeah. *01:23:06* I do fear Castlevania out *01:23:06* uh by the end of the year for sure just the quantity but I I've I I need a pokey break for a bit, but *01:23:08* I am looking forward to, you know, bringing everything up and over and not losing this pool of Pokemon that I have now and and all that stuff. *01:23:16* So it is going to be a lot of fun, I think, to *01:23:25* uh to bring these things into the future and you know still have them not lose them to a sale at GameStop anymore. *01:23:28* Uh and things like that. *01:23:36* It'll be nice. *01:23:38* For sure. *01:23:40* I'm looking forward to our final battle together. *01:23:40* And I'm looking forward to ending ending your hopes and dreams here of uh coming. *01:23:44* Truths and ideals. *01:23:48* So *01:23:50* Do I I don't know if you did, but I wrote down like my favorite games in in an order. *01:23:51* Oh, did you? *01:23:58* I did, because we played so many and I feel like Pokemon's pretty decisive in that way. *01:23:59* Yeah. *01:24:04* Go ahead and give me your order and I can sh fire from the hip here and tell you what my favorites are. *01:24:05* Pew pew. *01:24:10* Alright, so number 10 should surprise no one. *01:24:10* It's X and Y. *01:24:14* Get um X and Y. *01:24:16* Let me look here and I'll do it in order with you. *01:24:18* Yeah, I'd say that's probably my 102. *01:24:20* Yeah. *01:24:23* Yeah. *01:24:23* This one you're not gonna be happy with. *01:24:24* Go ahead. *01:24:26* No, I I do wanna preface. *01:24:28* I tried to do this from a critical perspective without any nostalgia, so I uh uh basically diamond and pearl are where I think they should be critically, not from a nostalgia perspective. *01:24:29* Okay, well this is gonna be like m mine will be more *01:24:38* Personaled it, I guess. *01:24:42* Yeah. *01:24:43* Okay, I could see that based on yourself. *01:24:46* Okay. *01:24:48* Yeah. *01:24:48* Um but then I mean nine for me would probably be Diamond Pearl, honestly. *01:24:49* Yeah. *01:24:54* Which I guess is like inverse for for both of us. *01:24:55* Yeah. *01:24:57* I put uh I put sword and shield at eight. *01:24:58* Not for a lack of trying, but I just I think I would put honestly, I think I would put Scarlet and Violet at eight. *01:25:01* And that doesn't mean I hate those games, but *01:25:06* They were also broken garbage messes when I played them, and I don't know if they've improved over the past year or more since I played them. *01:25:09* So I just think those games have a lot of potential, but they don't capitalize upon anything. *01:25:16* Unless, or well, I'll say this *01:25:21* Black and white too could maybe go in that slot too. *01:25:23* Like it's interchangeable between seven and eight with those for me. *01:25:25* Well, seven for me is red, blue, green, like the first shape. *01:25:30* Interesting. *01:25:33* Okay. *01:25:34* I figured that would be a little lower on yours. *01:25:35* Yeah, I mean, well again, black and white too is somewhere there. *01:25:36* Between seven and eight. *01:25:40* Scarlet and violet. *01:25:41* Swap those two. *01:25:42* Yeah. *01:25:43* And then I have black and white too at six. *01:25:44* Okay. *01:25:46* Six for me would likely be then I think *01:25:47* Sun and Moon? *01:25:54* Okay. *01:25:56* I think. *01:25:56* Or well, yeah, probably Sun and Moon. *01:25:57* I don't think those games are bad, but they're just not. *01:25:59* They're not upper tier for me. *01:26:02* Well, number five for me is Diamond and Pearl. *01:26:05* I think they're like I think they're the middle of the road. *01:26:07* They're like that nostalgic *01:26:10* First gen, but they try a couple of new things and they they really leaned into the world building. *01:26:12* I think they're like, this is like the standard, I think. *01:26:17* Five for me would be Sword and Shield. *01:26:21* I think those games are surprising how much I love them. *01:26:23* Like I still think They're so snappy. *01:26:25* They're such a snappy pair of games. *01:26:27* I I think back to that game, like *01:26:29* As we've done our discussion, like, 'cause those were some of the first games we played over the course of this season, and as we've progressively played more games in the series, like gone back or gone forward, like I've been like, man, I wish more games kinda did what they did here in Sword and Shield. *01:26:31* Especially like from a story perspective. *01:26:44* I feel like those games get a lot right with like introducing the legendaries and the lore and sprinkling it in throughout the entire game rather than kind of like we talked in this episode about like backloading it. *01:26:46* I think that's a big problem. *01:26:57* Um is good world design too. *01:26:59* It's a vertical journey. *01:27:00* You're going up the the land mass. *01:27:01* It's pretty cool that way. *01:27:04* Yeah. *01:27:05* It's nice. *01:27:05* Instead of a big circle. *01:27:05* Uh, number four for me is Sun and Moon. *01:27:07* I just really liked how different the formula was. *01:27:10* Like they really tried to do something different there with the island challenges and *01:27:12* hopping around the islands. *01:27:16* Now, do I remember what's on what island? *01:27:17* No, but I appreciated the effort and I I liked I liked that uh those two games that we played. *01:27:19* Uh four for me would probably be black and white. *01:27:26* Probably my favorite. *01:27:29* I just love the DEXs in those games. *01:27:31* Um there's a lot of things I think the gameplay really refines itself and it is far better in those games than anything else. *01:27:33* It re a lot of it comes down to the deck, so I really have a fondness for that Pokedex and just the idea of let's do hundred and fifty completely new Pokemon, you can't catch anything else than what is native to this region. *01:27:40* And I wish they would do that more. *01:27:51* I wish they would do that more. *01:27:53* Again, rather than the variant like no, there's a weird form diglet in this region and it's a water type. *01:27:54* It's funny. *01:28:05* Uh number three for me is Scarlet and Violet. *01:28:06* I think just the as as performance-wise poor those games are. *01:28:08* I think the gameplay loop of those games is so gripping. *01:28:13* And I think Arceus does it better, but that's not mainline or what Abby, but Scarlet and Violet. *01:28:16* I think the loop there is awesome. *01:28:22* And I think it's uh quite honestly my favorite music that we've had uh all season as well is Scarlet and Violet. *01:28:24* So I will say three is hard. *01:28:31* It's probably *01:28:38* It's probably red, blue, yellow, fire red, leaf green, whatever, all those. *01:28:41* I just think those games still hold up so well, and I think that's still one of the best dexes, and I know that's like *01:28:47* a normie take, but like those first hundred fifty, hundred fifty one Pokemon are like iconic, dude. *01:28:52* And they're so p perfect. *01:28:57* And there's a fantastic balance across the whole decks of different types and things like that. *01:28:59* I think those games have a *01:29:04* fantastic flow to them. *01:29:05* I think there's a lot of awesome world building. *01:29:07* I always think of like the uh the lab you come across on uh *01:29:09* Fire Fire Island. *01:29:14* The Fire Island where it's like talking to YouTube destroyed. *01:29:16* Yes, yes. *01:29:19* Like that stuff is so cool. *01:29:20* Um Team Rocket, Giovanni, like just all like *01:29:22* Like, a lot of it is nostalgic, yes, but like I really do think over the course of the whole series there is so much that even the modern games can look back to and like, what were we doing back then? *01:29:26* Like, why were these games such a big hit? *01:29:37* And I think there is still *01:29:38* elements of those games that hold up today, which is a huge achievement because this launched back in 1996. *01:29:40* They're 27 years old. *01:29:47* So. *01:29:48* Yeah, you gotta respect you gotta respect the origins, you know what I'm saying? *01:29:49* Alright, number two for me is black and white. *01:29:53* I just think visually this is the peak of Pokemon. *01:29:56* I think a lot of the gameplay is right. *01:29:59* It may the leveling may suck, but I think *01:30:01* Like the battles are really good here. *01:30:03* The decks is fun. *01:30:05* And they tried something mature with the story. *01:30:07* And it works at times. *01:30:10* It doesn't work in others. *01:30:12* But I really think black and white too's kind of like *01:30:13* It's the best looking and almost the best playing that Pokemon's been in a traditional sense. *01:30:16* So it brings it kind of up there for me. *01:30:21* Two is Ruby, Sapphire, Emerald. *01:30:24* I just it's I I can't those are the games I have played the most. *01:30:26* Dude, I have played those games probably *01:30:31* eight to ten times through to completion. *01:30:33* Like I wore I literally like wore one of my Game Boy SPs and down and broke it eventually because I played those games so much on it. *01:30:35* Like my original silver Game Boy, and I and I bought my Game Boy Advance SP with it, and my first game was Sapphire that I bought with it. *01:30:46* And so I just cannot separate that. *01:30:54* nostalgia and those like I just have strong adoration for those games and they came hit at a perfect time for me for like when the original Pokemon games came out. *01:30:57* Um, I was like a little like I still played them and I still got through them, but I was like almost like a little too young for it to like fully grip me, you know? *01:31:07* Like when Silver or when Sapphire and Ruby came out, I was like the perfect age to where I was like really understanding games and how they worked and like the intricacies of them all and I was really able to sink so much time in I just feel like there's so much depth in those games too. *01:31:15* Um like thinking about like the Reggie, the Regirok, Regia Ice, Regis Seal. *01:31:30* I know you never caught those, but there's like the methods you have to go through to get those. *01:31:35* Like the I just I love those games. *01:31:38* Total nostalgia, total personal bias with that. *01:31:41* And I know I acknowledge that they have some problems here and there, but adore those games. *01:31:44* I get it. *01:31:49* And then one is number one. *01:31:51* Number one is gold and silver. *01:31:53* Heart gold, soul, silver, man. *01:31:54* It is perfect. *01:31:55* The double continent red *01:31:58* Team Rocket, this 251 Pokemon decks, absolutely iconic. *01:32:02* Graphically, you know, it's some of the best. *01:32:08* I mean, really, it's the sprite work in black and white that elevates it, I think. *01:32:11* In my regard graphically, but two of the best remakes ever. *01:32:14* Silver and gold on their own are some of the best games I've ever, and then Soul Silver and Heart Gold are two of the best remakes I think ever. *01:32:18* The soundtracks are perfect. *01:32:26* There are flaws, like I remember back to our episode, like, why can't I catch a hound door on native Johto? *01:32:27* Why do I have to go all the way to Kanto in the back? *01:32:33* And there's force of the game to catch certain Pokemon. *01:32:36* And there is a grind and stuff, yes. *01:32:39* That's an interesting grind system there, but yeah, our gold slow silver ranges. *01:32:41* Reign Supreme, all hail. *01:32:45* Again, nor me take, but I really just do think that I mean it's it's hard to beat a game that has *01:32:47* Basically, like a dual campaign like that packed into it. *01:32:53* Like there's just so much meat on the bunk. *01:32:56* Yes. *01:33:06* And shout out to Awada for even coming up with that idea. *01:33:07* And shout out to Game Freak for finding a way to put all of that on a Game Boy color cart back in the day. *01:33:11* There's a lot to that game. *01:33:17* Yeah, it was a Game Boy cart actually. *01:33:19* Was it the Game Boy? *01:33:21* Crystal was Game Boy Colored. *01:33:22* That's right. *01:33:24* That's right. *01:33:24* That's right. *01:33:25* But black, but golden uh silver Game Boy carts. *01:33:25* They did have Game Boy Color enhancements, but definitely just worked on a regular Game Boy, had to capitalize the install base *01:33:29* Cause yeah, I know Awada, I mean, what's the story? *01:33:36* Awada was telling them they had to put Canto in it and they're like, we can't. *01:33:38* And he's like, no, no. *01:33:41* He figured out how to do it. *01:33:43* I'll I'll try and find the uh *01:33:44* It's an I wanna ask is where that story comes from. *01:33:47* I'll try and find it for the show notes. *01:33:49* Yeah. *01:33:51* Like that's just still the best. *01:33:51* Still the best. *01:33:54* And they still have touchstones to the originals and just *01:33:55* Yeah, everybody involved. *01:33:58* Fantastic, fantastic work. *01:34:00* Yeah, that's Pokemon. *01:34:02* That's Pokemon. *01:34:04* We'll be back with Pokemon, uh, what are they gonna call the next ones? *01:34:05* Um I mean, they kinda had gone back to colors, you know. *01:34:11* They were doing stones for a while and then letters and they did colors with black and white like *01:34:16* Yeah, so I don't know. *01:34:22* Um then they did weapons, sword and shield, sun and universe. *01:34:24* I don't know. *01:34:31* Uh *01:34:31* They'll bring it full circle. *01:34:33* They should go they should just keep doing colors. *01:34:34* That's the best, I think. *01:34:37* Keep doing colors. *01:34:38* Pokemon Magenta and *01:34:39* Uh lavender. *01:34:42* Sure. *01:34:43* There you go. *01:34:44* Even though that's quite literally like scarlet and violet, just the violet. *01:34:44* Just stick with the red and purple themes here. *01:34:49* I guess. *01:34:52* But yeah, we'll we'll be back someday. *01:34:52* We'll be back. *01:34:55* And we've talked about well, I don't want to say anything. *01:34:55* But we've talked about doing an episode on Arceus if I ever play it. *01:34:58* But who knows if that'll happen. *01:35:01* No promises. *01:35:02* We'll see. *01:35:04* We'll see. *01:35:05* But I think that'll do it for Pokemon Black and White 2 in season six of Chapter Select. *01:35:06* So thank you. *01:35:12* So much for listening and joining us along this season. *01:35:13* Going forward, we've got season seven and eight in the works. *01:35:15* That's Metroid Prime and Castlevania. *01:35:19* We're going to be just working on those at our pace and put them out when they're done and complete. *01:35:21* So look forward to that. *01:35:26* We've already recorded Metroid Prime, which has been fun. *01:35:27* So we're going to be moving into production on those seasons. *01:35:29* So thank you so much. *01:35:33* If you'd like. *01:35:33* To find our other seasons, you can just go over to chapterselect. *01:35:34* com. *01:35:37* We've got everything zero through six. *01:35:38* You can go listen to that and all that good stuff. *01:35:40* You could support the show by joining Super Chapter Select. *01:35:43* Go to chapterslack. *01:35:46* com or listening with superpower. *01:35:47* com, take you all to the same place. *01:35:49* For just two and a half bucks a month or $20 a year, you get access to longer episodes, uh, exclusive videos, and um *01:35:51* Um, you know, extra episodes like RCS we've talked about doing as a member special. *01:35:58* We've got Resident Evil 9, Hopes and Dreams. *01:36:04* We've got one on better luck tomorrow for our Fast and Furious season. *01:36:07* So all sorts of good stuff there for Pokemon. *01:36:11* We've done battles in every single game. *01:36:15* We're going to be using some fan servers here to knock out black and white too. *01:36:19* And then we'll do an ultimate battle where we bring up our team. *01:36:24* forward into Scarlet and Violet. *01:36:28* So you could join and check all of those out as well. *01:36:30* It's pretty pretty fun. *01:36:32* So thank you for supporting us over there. *01:36:34* If you'd like you can find Logan on Twitter at More Man Twelve and his writing over at comic book. *01:36:37* And if you'd like, you can find my writing over at maxfrequency. *01:36:43* net. *01:36:47* And until next time, till season seven, adios. *01:36:47* We'll see you on Brin Star. *01:36:52* Chapter Select is a max frequency production. *01:36:55* Chapter Select is supported by you. *01:36:59* You can gain access to longer episodes and bonus content by going to chapterselect. *01:37:01* com forward slash join. *01:37:06* This episode was research, produced, and edited by me, Max Roberts. *01:37:08* Season six is hosted by Logan Moore and myself *01:37:12* Season six is all about Pokemon. *01:37:16* For more on the season, go to chapterselect. *01:37:18* com forward slash season six. *01:37:20* You can follow the show at Chapter Select and check out previous seasons at chapterselect. *01:37:23* com *01:37:28*