# [[MFP35 - "Daddy Bedtimes" with Scott White]] Transcript This transcription was completed on March 4, 2026 with the application MacWhisper on macOS. This was done automatically, without human input during the transcription process. The transcription used the Parakeet v3 model. My hope is that by offering this transcription – however accurate it may be done by a machine learning/AI – will help you, the listener. I’d love to offer full, proper transcription some day, but that is not feasible at this time. Thank you for listening and reading. I hope you enjoy the show and that this document was helpful. Enjoy. --- Hello, everybody, and welcome to the Max Frequency Podcast. *00:00* I am your host, Max Roberts, and joining me this time returning my friend, the professor himself, Scott White. *00:03* Hello, Scott. *00:11* How are you? *00:12* Doing well, Max. *00:13* So good to talk to you again. *00:14* It's been a minute. *00:15* So it's good to nerd out a bit with you again. *00:16* Oh yes, it has been a minute. *00:19* It's been *00:21* Oh just over a year, around a year. *00:22* Uh you were on episode nineteen, a big bedon bedont bedant. *00:26* I don't know. *00:32* That's what I called it. *00:32* That's what I called it. *00:34* It was a January of twenty-three. *00:35* We were talking about Mega Man Battle Network Legacy Collection. *00:38* That was the hotness getting ready to come out. *00:43* So good. *00:46* And there's been so like I don't know if you've been keeping up with like the fan community of Bell Network, but like *00:47* random like Japanese cell phones were discovered to have the like thought to be lost digital like *00:55* Phantom of Network and Legend of Network games and they just like a week or two ago they released the fan translated versions of them that you can play. *01:02* And it's like, what? *01:11* That's so cool. *01:13* It is awesome. *01:14* I remember *01:15* Not those, obviously, 'cause I didn't realize they existed. *01:17* But I remember freaking out about that with um Kingdom Hearts and Coded, Kingdom Hearts Coded, a Japanese cell phone game. *01:20* And then obviously that got brought over to the DS eventually, but *01:27* They had some really m do you do you ever remember a God of War Betrayal, the cell phone game? *01:30* I do not. *01:37* It is canon. *01:39* They count it. *01:41* There's there was a FAQ on like the God of War website and says how many God of War games are there? *01:42* And it they gave the number or whatever it was at the time. *01:47* And if you tally it all up, it includes betrayal. *01:50* Like they *01:53* it canonically counts and Sony acknowledges its existence. *01:53* It's really so very goofy. *01:57* Um that can that's really *01:59* Now, kind of just because we're going off on random tangents, did you hear about the um like huge fan kind of mod for uh Kingdom Hearts 358 by two days? *02:02* Um that someone had made using a a special like modded version of Citra, which is like the th or the three, but melon. *02:15* Melon. *02:24* Uh that gives like three fifty eight by two days. *02:25* widescreen support, they make it a single screen game, uh they do all this stuff to it. *02:30* No. *02:35* To make it like a game you can play on your on your PC and stuff. *02:36* That sounds incredible. *02:40* I know. *02:42* I only f found out about it earlier this week. *02:43* But since we're talking about A, we you brought up Kingdom Hearts. *02:45* And fan things and random mobile things. *02:49* I figured this would fit, so it is 358 over two. *02:53* That was a game I obsessed over. *02:59* Both preview cycle and the game itself, I uh I still have the the cover issue of Nintendo Power with it. *03:02* You know, that iconic Kingdom Hearts art. *03:10* That just is so captivating. *03:13* I reread that interview over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. *03:15* Um and then *03:19* I got the game, so I went on a cruise here. *03:21* This actually all ties together. *03:25* This is beautiful. *03:26* Yeah. *03:27* So ironically, the day we're recording this, which is I believe the 29th of May, 2024. *03:28* Yep. *03:33* This is the 16-year anniversary of the very first podcast uh I ever published, ironically. *03:34* And I bring that up because one of my co-hosts on that show *03:42* Uh I was, I don't know, twelve at the time. *03:46* Mm-hmm. *03:51* Uh he and his family they invited me on a cruise. *03:53* And I had never met this person before in my life. *03:57* And for some reason my parents let me go. *04:00* I don't know. *04:04* But anyway, my parents gave me money, and I flew to Louisiana to meet them. *04:05* And we stopped in like a mall or whatever. *04:12* And so I took the money meant for souvenirs and trinkets. *04:14* And I went to a GameStop. *04:17* And I bought Kingdom Hearts and Wario Wear DIY. *04:20* And my mom was disappointed that I spent all my money on video games instead of knick-knack trinkets, but *04:25* I still have Kingdom Hearts. *04:34* I do not have WarioWare, which I do kind of regret. *04:35* But um I still have Kingdom. *04:38* And let's be real, you you would have pitched *04:39* I have nothing I have nothing left from because I did get a couple of tiny things, but uh none of that is still around. *04:44* But I still have Kingdom Hearts, so who's the winner? *04:52* And I remember playing it on the ship. *04:54* Um, one time I couldn't sleep or something. *04:56* It was the middle of the night, and I went out on deck and I had my DS with me and I was alone on a cruise ship playing Kingdom Hearts. *04:58* So I've a I have a fondness for this game and it's such a shame that when they redid everything, they didn't eventually make a playable version of it. *05:04* It's still just cutscenes. *05:14* in this HD era. *05:16* I was gonna say that. *05:17* It's like it is such a shame that this didn't get the re chain of memories upgrade treatment. *05:18* Granted that was a PS2 game, but yada yada, but like *05:25* Come on now. *05:29* Come on. *05:31* It feels more important than c recoded to get like the HD, but again, those *05:32* This is me assuming game development ease, but they both were on the DS, those games, so I imagine the asset crossover is very similar. *05:40* So if you bring one up, I assume bringing the other up isn't *05:47* Right. *05:57* But I I was saying if you brought it up from the DS, but I guess you'd have to rebuild everything anyway, because you're not taking those D *05:57* Yeah. *06:06* None of it. *06:06* It's such a shame though, man. *06:07* This game was so cool. *06:08* It was like you can play as the organization and it had *06:10* Uh multiplayer. *06:13* Multiplayer. *06:14* I remember this. *06:15* I was terrible at the time, but I was at Dual Shockers in my one and only PAX I went to, which was twenty nineteen PAX East. *06:16* Mm-hmm. *06:23* And Chris Cambendio, big Kingdom Hearts fan. *06:24* uh they invited me like we came up with the idea to play together um to bring our DSs because we both had never played the multiplayer. *06:28* in 358. *06:38* But I was in a funk the night that we decided to play, so I was a little rude. *06:39* And uh I think I apologized. *06:43* And if not, this is my public profession and apology to you, Chris. *06:45* But uh I was I was a little short and not the nicest person. *06:49* I would think I was having a little Pax Funk. *06:53* Um it happens. *06:57* So but we did play it, and it's so goofy that all right, goofy was probably a poor choice awards there. *06:59* Uh but you can play as Mickey Mouse in, I believe in his organization. *07:06* Cloak. *07:12* But you can play as all the organization members, which is so cool. *07:13* It's what a good game. *07:16* You can play as Sora. *07:19* I think Sora and Mickey are like unlockable characters. *07:20* Unlockable three *07:23* fifty eight over two characters. *07:25* That's a Google shirt Google search that will work. *07:27* Oh look, IGN NDS cheats. *07:30* What a deep cut here. *07:33* As well as Riku, Donald, Goofy, the King, and Sora. *07:35* Nice. *07:39* I remember Mickey and thinking that was very silly. *07:40* Mm-hmm. *07:43* Oh my goodness gracious. *07:45* Well, since the last time we spoke, just over a year ago, you've become a dad. *07:47* I have. *07:53* Congratulations. *07:54* Oh, thank you so much. *07:55* I know. *07:58* It's been fun. *07:58* He's uh ten months old, little Oliver. *07:59* um crawling and borderline walking and babbling and smiling all the time. *08:02* He's just he's a he's a joy. *08:08* It's the best. *08:10* The baby babbles are some of the funniest and cutest things I've ever heard. *08:12* Or the best sounds. *08:18* It's great. *08:19* It is *08:20* Kids are really a joy. *08:22* I love it. *08:24* I Eloise is I just say a year and a half. *08:24* I'm not one of those by the month. *08:29* Dad's, I just now that she's a ye she's over a year, I'm just doing it every six months. *08:31* So she's a year and a half, but she'll be two in September. *08:36* And uh she's *08:39* She's this close to like forming sentences that are coherent. *08:42* Oh wow. *08:46* Beyond just pointing and saying a word for a thing. *08:46* And her latest skill is *08:50* We seem to have identified most barnyard animals both by appearance and sound they make. *08:54* Uh so *09:00* We have fun throwing little barnyard animals and she goes and retrieves them and then mimics the sound of them. *09:02* But I'm trying to teach her that that donkeys they don't say he-haw, they say in the morning I'm making waffles. *09:10* And I'm trying to get her to which is very difficult for a two-year-old. *09:18* And then I'm trying to get her to s for ducks instead of quack quack. *09:21* Or she would say whack wa ac. *09:26* Um don't have quite the cue sound down *09:29* Uh, do you have any grapes? *09:31* Is kind of what I'm trying to teach her. *09:34* We'll see if those stick in the long run. *09:36* But as someone who's *09:39* Slight like what, oh gosh. *09:44* Let's just ballpark it and say a year ahead, give or take a few months. *09:47* A year ahead and dad dad them. *09:51* I at least know that since having a child, my game playing has completely changed. *09:54* Like my habits and time. *09:59* Yeah. *10:01* Yeah. *10:02* I'm kind of curious where you're at, which is the balance of dad. *10:02* mode and then personal game mode. *10:07* So for it really depends, like when I'm reviewing a game or am doing something that will help me pay for daycare. *10:11* Um my wife is exponentially more uh uh um open to me playing games, especially for longer stretches of time. *10:20* Yeah. *10:29* Um but outside of that it's *10:29* Um I still ha have a couple hours a night, but it's like I don't I'm in this weird rut where *10:34* Nothing I'm not getting that like a big draw to play something. *10:42* Like I'll I'll play like um portable games. *10:46* I have a whole new appreciation for games I can play laying in bed or remote play, things like that. *10:48* Um *10:55* But I'm kind of just like in a I don't know what I wanna play kind of mood unless there's like a big game like Final Fantasy VII Rebirth or 16 or Trails coming out like unless it's like a big game that I'm really looking forward to *10:55* I'm just kinda like, okay. *11:09* Um with working so I do a lot of computer work and working in the Unreal Engine for my normal job. *11:11* So when I get done *11:20* Unless I have something like I I'm reviewing or doing guides for, I uh honestly kind of turn away from the screen and I'm reading a lot more, just like reading for fun. *11:23* Um *11:34* And that that's kind of how I end my nights. *11:35* I uh with the unknown of when Oliver will wake up at night, I kind of go to bed or start shutting down early where *11:38* Like so right now we're recording this around nine o'clock and usually I would be like, okay, I'm I'm in bed, I'm I'm reading at this point. *11:49* Yeah, you're shutting down and yeah. *11:57* Um *11:59* But it's like I still get those like like when I'm at work or like just sitting around, it's like I wanna I wanna stream, I wanna play games. *12:01* But it's like I'm not drawn to like one game. *12:08* It it's almost like analysis or analysis per paralysis or like too too many options to play. *12:12* Um *12:19* But yeah, it's like I play when I can, when I feel like it, or when I'm doing it for work. *12:21* Um *12:28* Yeah. *12:30* That's that's where I've mostly found myself over this last year and a half with chapter select being kind of the primary *12:31* Kicker to play a bunch of games. *12:42* And it just so happens that the games that we were playing when *12:45* We had Eloise and since then our big series with Resident Evil, which we talked about together, and then Pokemon. *12:49* Which are big and beefy. *12:57* We finished those and now we're in this Metroid and Castlevania season of life. *12:59* But so far this year we've kinda Logan and I have taken *13:04* a bit of a pot like a almost like a summer vacation. *13:09* He's finally played Elden Ring, which I've wanted him to play for so long because he's such a big Souls fan and he hasn't touched it at all. *13:11* And I I finally chipped away at um *13:19* I finally beat Great Ace Attorney to Resolve thanks to the collection. *13:22* So and then obviously I had to play I finally played Last of Us Part One leading into part two remastered. *13:26* So I got my kind of double feature there. *13:33* But really I've used that to keep me on track. *13:36* Beyond that, I haven't played anything additional outside of the show. *13:39* Uh I've dabbled like Abby and I one night played Mario Party 2. *13:45* So after Eloise went to bed we we busted out the Switch and just played Mario Party 2, which was actually pretty fun and funny because we both for we *13:49* We forgot how hard the computer is in that game. *13:58* And Donkey Kong kicked our buttons like it w *14:04* We were not on a team together and she was trying to do you know, we're trying to beat each other, but quickly we united to try and stop Donkey Kong and it failed. *14:06* So that was it. *14:15* I the other thing that I remember doing *14:17* was cause I haven't I haven't been paid to play a game since twenty *14:21* 20? *14:30* 2019? *14:32* Somewhere in there. *14:33* The last game I was paid to play was Mario Kart Tour. *14:33* I did a l a season stretch for the wiki *14:37* That was the last one I was paid for, I believe. *14:40* Yes. *14:43* Yeah. *14:44* I think it's still accessible. *14:44* I don't know if it's getting more updates. *14:47* But yeah, I did the mobile game for like one season of that, which was pretty interesting. *14:49* Um it's obviously very microtransaction-y, but you don't have to engage with it. *14:55* And I did *14:59* didn't do that. *15:00* So it uh I at least I've I've sunk some time into that. *15:01* But I remember talking with Abby in *15:05* I was just like, on th on Thursday night can you put her to bed specifically and I'll just after dinner *15:11* in a cleanup and stuff like that's when I'll go play something to try and get some chunk of time a significant instead of what I normally do is play in the mornings. *15:18* So I'm up before either one of them. *15:27* And *15:30* I'll get up, I'll do my thing, and then I'll maybe have an hour, somewhere between 30 minutes to an hour to play something. *15:31* something. *15:39* And that's when I try to fit stuff in. *15:40* Um because I'm too old of a man by the time Eloise goes to bed, Abby and I do yoga. *15:42* And then I'm like ready for bed. *15:50* So I'm an old man and go to bed between nine thirty and ten *15:53* Yeah. *15:58* And I uh I just can't keep I can't stay awake at night to play a game unless it's Fortnite with the boys or something. *15:58* And that you know, that keeps me energized. *16:06* But *16:08* That has been the the cadence or rhythm lately. *16:09* Like I still haven't played uh Tears of the Kingdom. *16:12* That is uh that's next on my docket though, is my follow-up. *16:16* I'm *16:21* I'm finally gonna play it. *16:22* Uh it came out right when we moved. *16:24* Yeah. *16:26* And I just haven't touched it. *16:27* I just want to say I'm so glad Baldur's Gate beat Tears of the Kingdom last year. *16:29* Like at the game awards? *16:34* Like in everything In everything. *16:36* It it seemed like even now so many things are being talked about about Baldur's Gate, like memes and characters and yada yada yada fan art, but like Tears of the Kingdom, like *16:40* Crickets. *16:52* And it's like as a person who never I appreciated what Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom did *16:53* But I legitimately had more fun watching the videos of what people made of Tears of in inside Tears of the Kingdom than I ever did actually playing it. *16:59* And and I *17:07* Scratch that. *17:10* I enjoyed when the item duplication stuff was still in, and I lost so much interest when Nintendo patched all that out. *17:11* Like I legit have an old Switch with that's my Tears machine that I won't ever upgrade. *17:20* So if I ever do want to play it, I can have all the kind of like *17:25* I don't have to worry about farming for th this or that or to make all the funny things, but Well couldn't you *17:28* Couldn't you just put in the physical version of the game and just not patch it? *17:36* Uh that not how that would work unless but the problem is Nintendo made it so you have to update it to play it. *17:40* Oh really? *17:51* Oh interesting. *17:52* I did that. *17:52* Yes, they have they do this kind of sh thing where um I think it's tied to the switch's firmware itself. *17:53* Like it *18:00* notices it's like it's an unpatched thing. *18:01* It's like you can't even start a f like a physical cartridge of a game if it's not to the correct *18:03* Um patch. *18:09* Huh. *18:11* I've I've never seen that before. *18:11* Yeah. *18:14* So I guess that Interesting. *18:14* That is sucky, 'cause you should just be able to 'cause it runs from the cart, you should be able to just boot it, huh? *18:17* Hmm. *18:24* Not cool Nintendo. *18:25* Just let us play the cartridge, please. *18:27* Let me duplicate things. *18:29* It's a single-player game with no like online leaderboards, so let's just let me do all my crazy stupid things. *18:31* Yeah. *18:38* It's interesting you say that. *18:38* I'm I was a w I'm aware of the things you're talking about in passing. *18:40* But since I've been off Twitter for *18:45* Oh gosh. *18:50* I don't know. *18:52* A solid year and a half, two years? *18:53* Yeah, a fortnight. *18:57* It's been a while. *18:58* So I missed all of the buzz and talk around Tears of the Kingdom and most games. *19:00* of significant size and stature. *19:08* Like everything I'm getting is either from a YouTube video. *19:10* And I had previously like trained YouTube to not show me Zelda stuff because I was trying to remain spoiler free. *19:13* And *19:20* Articles like just things like that. *19:22* Or someone will share something in a Discord I'm in and then I kind of get touch points there. *19:23* So like I saw a couple of funny things that people made. *19:27* I remember like um *19:31* Like a burning man type thing with uh with lava or fire appendages and things like that. *19:33* Like I remember that in the beginning. *19:40* But I really have no idea *19:42* what happens in Tears of the Kingdom, both from I get that you build things like uh nuts and bolts, which is my favorite analogy. *19:45* But beyond that, I really don't uh know the scope. *19:56* of the sky stuff or the underground stuff like I don't know and I'm excited to finally figure that out which will be cool but back to your original thing which is I'm glad it beat Baldur's Gate *19:59* I have also not played Baldur's Gate, but I am I'm glad Baldur's Gate beat it. *20:11* Oh yes. *20:15* Sorry, thank you. *20:15* Yes, Baldur's Gate beat it in most things. *20:16* And I would just from having not played either one of them or really knowing much about either one of them. *20:19* I would agree in that sense, simply because while Baldur's Gate does have the number three in the title, it is it's new, right? *20:25* It's this wholly new incarnation of yeah, that game. *20:34* And Tears of the Kingdom, while I'm sure is a great game, and I'm at least at the very least I'm going to enjoy it. *20:39* I'm I'm confident in that statement. *20:45* It is more *20:47* Breath of the Wild or refined Breath of the Wild or whatever you want to put it. *20:49* And there's a known quantity to that, and I think there's a depth and richness, it sounds like in Baldur's Gate. *20:54* That really connected with a lot of people. *21:02* And I appreciate that. *21:07* I think that that's more exciting to me from like a an award perspective or *21:08* type thing. *21:14* Yeah. *21:14* Like what's new and pushing things forward. *21:15* And I think just like developers have looked at Breath of the Wild for the last *21:16* Is it seven years? *21:22* I think it's seven years. *21:24* Uh the last seven years and have implemented the things from that game into games we're seeing today in the past couple of years, I imagine Baldur's Gate is going to have a similar effect. *21:25* on RPGs going forward is kind of what I'm sensing from it. *21:36* You correct me if I'm wrong, but does that sound correct-ish? *21:41* I I m so *21:46* I think a lot of companies will try to cash in and do the Baldur's Gate thing without realizing *21:49* what effort and like passion it took to make Baldur's Gate 3 as good as like Baldur's Gate III was. *21:58* Mm-hmm. *22:04* I'm super concerned that Baldur's Gate 4 will just be Hasbro throwing a bunch of money at a studio to push out a *22:04* Baldur's Gate four um in a couple years just to to cash in on the name without really understanding w what went into it. *22:11* It and not every game needs to be Baldur's Gate 3. *22:20* Like it's probably a a generational defining game. *22:26* But it's a game that not everyone should um try to replicate. *22:32* I think the biggest takeaway developers should have with Baldur's Gate 3 is that *22:39* Give games the time they need to cook to be w what they can be, to be as good as they need to be, and make games that your team is passionate about. *22:45* Make make the kind of game where your director will go to an award show in a suit of armor. *22:57* Yeah. *23:04* Have have fun with it, you know? *23:05* Have fun with it. *23:07* I um also have Google give you a bunch of money and then and then shut it all down. *23:09* Yeah, but that's my takeaway. *23:17* Rest in peace stadia. *23:20* I like the sound of that. *23:21* Um I don't think Baldur's Gate is a game for me. *23:23* It's it's like it's a few notches too *23:26* deep of an RPG or too traditional, it seems to me, in that sense. *23:31* I'm more Witcher is probably like as deep as I'll go. *23:36* in an RPG. *23:42* But I do l like the idea of it. *23:45* Does that make sense? *23:49* Like I like the It is a great multiplayer game. *23:50* That is I didn't even know it was a multiplayer game until a buddy of mine, he plays m predominantly on PC and he wanted to play a game together and he said, Well, the games I'm playing with *23:55* his other friends right now was Baldur's Gate three or uh Helldivers Two. *24:08* And I was like, well Helldivers Two is forty dollars and like a team shooter, you know *24:13* is way more my speed than than Baldur's Gate. *24:21* And I was like, I'll do Helldivers. *24:24* But I did that was when I learned that it was even a multiplayer game. *24:25* I don't I don't even understand. *24:28* I guess that fits though with the Dungeons and Dragons type *24:30* theme, right? *24:34* Yeah. *24:35* Um I mean it's it's very much the Dungeons and Dragons experience. *24:42* Right, and so is b you can correct me if I'm wrong here on this too, is so is Baldur's Gate like a sub-property of Dungeons and Dragons, or like how are the two related? *24:48* Because Hasbro owns Dungeons and Dragons, right? *25:00* Yeah. *25:03* Or is it or is it Wizards of the Coast or whatever it is? *25:03* Yeah. *25:07* So Hasbro owns the license to Bald or um *25:07* Uh whatchamacallit? *25:12* Dungeons and Dragons. *25:13* But um Baldur's Gate in like Forgotten Realms is like *25:15* a plane of existence within Dungeons and Dragons proper. *25:20* So you there are like source books and things that this is all kind of pulls from like characters and lore and things. *25:24* Okay. *25:31* So it's like it exists in the *25:31* The wider Yeah. *25:34* Got it. *25:38* Okay, that makes sense to me. *25:38* I was because I the two kind of keep coming up together and I was like, uh I assume they're related then if they keep mentioning it. *25:39* It's more than just uh it's like dungeon. *25:45* Dungeons and Dragons. *25:47* It seemed normal. *25:48* They have um source books and things for that describe like the cities there, um, and whatnot. *25:55* So *26:02* Got it. *26:02* Okay. *26:03* Very, very cool. *26:04* And speaking of RPGs, the difficulty of said RPGs and the levels of them. *26:05* I found it kinda I not even kinda I found it interesting. *26:11* I was kind of scrolling through your Twitter or X account. *26:17* I guess now. *26:20* Um and came across you Super Mario RPG and you had mentioned that you wanted you like the idea of this of introducing RPGs *26:21* to Oliver through this game and and potentially others. *26:31* And I *26:35* And I think you would too. *26:38* I always have thought about like how would I introduce games to my kids should they even be interested in them. *26:40* And an article that's always stuck with me, and I've I've talked about it on this show before, but it's it's Playing with My Son by Andy Bao. *26:47* Um basically the gist of it is *26:56* Andy, when his son was four, gave him a plug and play Pac-Man joystick thing. *27:00* And uh from there, uh, for the next, I don't know, four or five years *27:05* Basically took his son through the console generations. *27:11* Uh, you know, Atari 2600, NES, Super Nintendo, and and so on and so forth. *27:14* All the way up to uh I think N64 is kind of where they stopped going in order and then they jumped to PC and and things like that. *27:19* And I've liked that idea for Eloise. *27:27* Um, but I'm curious what you are like thinking or planning, because ten months far away from *27:30* Uh obviously being able to even I did see the picture of him holding a PlayStation controller though. *27:38* That was very cute. *27:43* He loves my silver dual shock four controller. *27:44* Like that is his by far favorite thing to go after. *27:48* Well it's his now. *27:52* Yeah. *27:53* Well that's the thing. *27:53* Like he gums it up. *27:54* Yeah. *27:56* And so it's like, okay, I will go online and see if they s they don't still make the silver one. *27:57* So it's like, well, do I want to buy eighty dollars for a baby toy? *28:02* Not really. *28:06* So I get the uh Fisher Price one and just spray paint it. *28:07* You know *28:12* I have the Fisher pr I have this Fisher Price one, but man, it's not as cool as the Silver Dual Jacques 4 that's years into the U. *28:14* years old, but uh but yeah, he's uh he loves the controllers. *28:22* He's he's learning the the hold hand the handhold of it, so he's gonna get the claw. *28:27* You got to. *28:35* It's a it's a part of our nature. *28:36* But what so like what are you thinking about? *28:39* I don't know, maybe I'm thinking too far ahead for myself, but what's what are you envisioning? *28:43* Should Oliver express interest, besides chewing on a controller, and actually playing something, you know, that dad plays or or anything like that? *28:47* Like what is what are you thinking? *28:57* I'd like the idea of to s I like I would probably s I 'cause *28:59* I feel like I read the same article or heard about it years ago because I r th remember thinking it's such a good idea, but I never was *29:05* The the Atari was before me, so I would start at the NES era and uh I think it's a really fun idea. *29:13* Um *29:20* There he will I don't think it can pull uh a rug over his eyes so he doesn't know that there's better looking video games ever. *29:22* Yeah, I don't think that's possible. *29:34* The author in the article you mentioned did uh or was trying to do, but I like the idea of like, okay, this is let's let's play some Mario, like, you know, NES Mario or and *29:36* kind of working up to it. *29:47* Um but with portable emulation technology now, it's like the fact that I can walk around in my pocket with a little emulated like a little handheld game system that's like a PSP but play up through *29:49* PS two games and by the time he's four it'll be playing PS three and PS four games. *30:02* It's it's nutty, but *30:09* having like a little device I can quickly plug into my T V and it's like here's every Nintendo game or here are the best ones. *30:10* Um i it's exciting and I'm anxious to see *30:17* what he gravitates towards. *30:22* He loves also going towards my bookshelves, so it's like, is he gonna be more of a board game kid than video games? *30:24* Or is he gonna kind of split between? *30:30* Is he, heaven forbid, going to be a jock? *30:32* Um and make me watch sports. *30:36* I don't know. *30:39* Learn learn the sports. *30:40* Uh *30:42* Y but yeah, I have I haven't put too much thought into it. *30:43* Just because the technology is changing so f rapidly anymore that who knows what technology will be like when he is four or five. *30:48* Um and what will really be available. *30:55* So who knows even what I'll have when in the next cause I'm thinking *30:57* I started playing games at five. *31:03* And so like my brain in my brain, that just seems like a good age to start. *31:06* I don't know. *31:10* But I have this really I have that 8-bit dough. *31:11* uh arcade stick 'cause it it seems like an approachable arcade stick without getting into the really complicated stuff for like ninety bucks. *31:14* And I'm like, what if you just give her that and you just you boot up the mister and you put Pac-Man *31:22* Like here's Pac-Man or here's Galaga or you know, any of those. *31:28* I feel like that's kind of interesting, 'cause they *31:33* theoretically have no frame of reference for any of this. *31:37* To be fair, she was a few weeks old when I was playing Resident Evil 4 and she was sleeping in my arms, but she's not gonna remember that. *31:40* Uh *31:49* And so I like that idea, but I'm the selfishness comes through and I'm like, but the N64 is where I started and like really picked things up. *31:51* And I feel like that's *32:01* That's where my love of things really blossomed, you know? *32:03* Smash Brothers, Paper Mario, Zelda, Banjo Kazooie, all that stuff. *32:06* And it's like, well *32:12* Dang, all this stuff is at the fingertips. *32:13* I don't know. *32:17* And then I start spiraling out, and I'm like, but then you have everything at your fingertips. *32:17* And it's like now you're overwhelmed and you have that analysis paralysis. *32:21* Yeah. *32:25* But she doesn't have analysis paralysis. *32:25* She doesn't know. *32:27* And I hear *32:28* You know, I have friends with kids who are much older and they're like they're cutscene skippers and then they come back later and go, Well, what's happening in the story? *32:30* And it's like, well, if you just sat there and watched it, you would know. *32:37* Mm-hmm. *32:40* Or uh, you know, they're bouncing between games all over the place. *32:41* And I don't know. *32:45* I'm I'm very optimistic going forward with this eventually. *32:46* And just seeing how video games take shape. *32:52* She loves controllers and remotes and and also but the kids just love pushing buttons and making things blip and bloop. *32:54* But I mean, I f<unk>ing love pushing buttons and making things blips and boops. *33:01* So I mean that sounds like a great time. *33:05* Give me like a six pack and s things that beep and boop and have good clicky keys. *33:08* Yeah, that is the best. *33:13* Um the *33:14* uh staring at all my controllers and it's certainly yes, I clearly also love things that beep and boop. *33:15* I've made an entire lifestyle out of it, so I guess it's the the curse of us going forward. *33:23* I am so it's so Super Mario RPG? *33:29* Yeah, do you really is that like a primo early *33:34* RPG you think? *33:39* Cause I my gut is always like Pokemon. *33:40* Pokemon is baby's first RPG. *33:45* to a degree, but how are you is that where you would start or just like that's on the sample platter of RPGs? *33:47* As the professor, you know, what do you are you throwing them into Final Fantasy *33:53* No, okay. *33:59* The thing like why I would probably opt for the sp specifically Super Mario RPG remake, um *34:01* over something like Pokemon. *34:09* It's like Pokemon you're still dealing with strategy, like type advantage. *34:10* Like there's a more mechanics that *34:16* play a bigger role in success. *34:19* Um, not to say that you can't just level your way out of any predictable *34:22* But with Super Mario RPG, especially the specifically the remake, it's more about you don't have to worry about okay *34:27* I have to swap Mallow in because this enemy is weak against lightning. *34:36* It's like, I want Mario to jump on things. *34:40* Cool. *34:42* He's jumping on things because I'm hitting the button just like the game. *34:43* And *34:46* There and it's got like the super flashy limit break attacks now that weren't in the original, and then the game wasn't the new game wasn't balanced around a lot of the new mechanics. *34:46* Like a lot of the cool like swapping out party members. *34:57* So all the boss fights and things are still geared towards you having a party of three as opposed to a party of six now. *35:01* Um *35:09* And just hitting A does something. *35:10* Um, Y does something, like it's tied to the face buttons *35:14* And you don't and it's easy, the writing's funny. *35:18* Um it's got cute zany graphics. *35:22* But yeah, that I think just a mix of all those reasons are why I I think *35:25* make Super Mario RPG such a great introductory RPG experience where you can let the kid run around, try the combat in tough times *35:31* easy hand over the controller. *35:42* Um and it's just kind of fun to to watch. *35:44* So yeah. *35:47* I think it's it's definitely up there. *35:48* as I can't think of another RPG that I think is better as like baby's first RPG, like at six *35:51* Yeah. *36:00* Like maybe six or like seven or eight. *36:01* Yeah. *36:04* At seven or eight, then it's like, okay, yeah, let's do let's do some Pokemon. *36:04* I have yet to play Super Mario RPG. *36:09* Uh that was one that *36:12* eluded me as a child. *36:14* I became aware of it. *36:15* I think like most people, uh, with Super Smash Bros. *36:17* Brawl and the Geno rumors was when I first became aware of even its existence. *36:20* as this precursor to Paper Mario, which I loved uh and still do love. *36:27* And then early COVID. *36:33* 21 maybe, or maybe 20. *36:37* I don't remember specifically. *36:39* I think maybe it was twenty-one. *36:41* Uh some guy on Facebook was selling some games and one of them was Super Mario RPG and I snagged it from *36:43* him for 25 bucks. *36:51* I'm like, this is this is the move. *36:53* And I have yet to play it. *36:55* And then now the remake has come out and I have not picked it up yet. *36:57* Uh that's just budgetary reasons. *37:00* trying to buy buy less this year in the game department. *37:03* I saw my list of all the games I bought in uh *37:06* 2023, like just picked up, and it it was actually quite shameful at 65 games. *37:11* And uh I don't I'd have to go through, I didn't mark like how many of those I specifically played, but like the collection *37:21* behavior got a little out of hand in 2023, so I've reigned it way back. *37:29* And so far in 2024, so my plan was to only buy um *37:35* three games that has not happened. *37:42* Uh but the three games are Super Mario Brothers Wonder, and that was because I made up this rule of three after I had bought it due to a price error at Target for, I don't know, 30 bucks or something. *37:45* Of course. *37:55* The last was part two remastered. *37:56* That's just Max essentials. *37:58* Um, and then the Thousand Your Door remake, which I want to talk to you about. *38:02* But then uh for my birthday, I uh so I did get Helldivers 2 to play with that friend. *38:07* So that was um but that was a gift, someone gave that to me. *38:13* So I don't have to pay for that. *38:16* But for my birthday, PlayAsia had a deal where you could get three games for a hundred bucks. *38:18* And having just finished the Great Ace Attorney. *38:23* Chronicles, I said, now is the time to get both a copy of the Phoenix Rite trilogy, which is only in Japan. *38:27* physical and then I snagged a Japanese copy of Apollo Justice solely because uh the spines say I assume ace attorney or I think it's *38:36* Gecto Saibon. *38:50* Saibon? *38:51* Something like that. *38:52* Saibon. *38:53* I know the Saibon part. *38:54* I don't remember the front. *38:55* But it it says that, presumably. *38:56* And then it has a 1, 2, 3. *38:58* And then Apollo Justice trilogy has four, five, six, and they line up on the spines, and it just is so visually satisfying to me. *39:00* Mm-hmm. *39:07* So I bought that. *39:08* And then the third game *39:09* I learned late last year, kinda November ish time, that for some reason, Final Fantasy VII Remake Integrade for the PlayStation 5. *39:12* costs is not in production anymore in North America and costs like a hundred and forty dollars used and *39:25* And I was like, that is Seriously? *39:32* What? *39:34* Yes. *39:35* So the physical version of Integrade, which is PS5 exclusive, uh is no longer in print in North America, and the secondhand market is like 120 plus. *39:36* So I got the Japanese one because it has English on the disc and like you can play it and that was only like four, you know, by itself I think goes for like forty bucks. *39:47* Well then, so I bought that in like early May or whatever. *39:57* Those just shipped a week or two ago and they just showed up yesterday. *40:01* Nice. *40:06* But *40:07* Maybe last week I had to go to a UPS store and next door was a GameStop and I was like, I'll go walk into there. *40:09* GameStops are pretty depressing these days, but it's always worth. *40:18* I usually go in actually to see if there are Wii U games, ironically, because sometimes they have like a tiny, tiny Wii U section. *40:21* But what do I see when I walk in the door right there to the left? *40:29* Final Fantasy VII remake integrated for the PS5 for $60. *40:33* And I'm like. *40:39* Like, well crap, now I have to buy this. *40:40* Yeah. *40:44* Uh so now I have two copies of Final Fantasy VII Remake Integrate. *40:45* It sounds like a good investment. *40:50* It is, but it's really it's Eloise's investment, 'cause I'll never I I can't I won't sell *40:53* It. *40:59* You know, that's my problem. *41:00* So anyway, I've only bought eight games so far this year, which I think is a lot better than 60, whatever I had. *41:02* From last year so far. *41:08* So Yeah. *41:09* So far so good. *41:11* Long tangent aside. *41:13* Paper Mario. *41:17* We're just jumping right in. *41:19* Yeah. *41:21* Because it's semi-related to Super Mario RPG, but you joined Logan and myself on Chapter Slick season one episode three. *41:21* A whopping three years ago now. *41:31* Holy smokes. *41:34* Um, but since then, Nintendo finally heard our pleas, our cries, they've answered our prayers. *41:36* They have remade it for the Nintendo Switch from the ground up Intelligent Systems back at the helm. *41:44* It just came out. *41:51* How are we feeling? *41:54* How are you feeling? *41:55* Uh I have two copies due to a GameStop error both sealed and I haven't touched it. *41:57* Tell me about the error, what happened? *42:04* Uh I gotta notice that my payment was declined, so I used another payment method, and that wasn't declined. *42:07* Um, but then I got charged and received two copies, including the one that my payment was declined for. *42:13* And yes, I was charged for both. *42:19* So why not just return the second one? *42:22* Because I know how all the Paper Mario stuff goes, and this will probably be *42:25* Much like a r an integrade. *42:33* Uh I'll keep one sealed. *42:35* Good mana, good man. *42:37* I have a sora Or maybe I'll keep both sealed. *42:39* I don't know. *42:41* We'll see. *42:42* I uh I have a Sora amiibus amiibo sealed for *42:43* same reasons. *42:47* I'm just I'm like this is the one. *42:48* This is the one. *42:50* All so I have two sealed amiibos, Sora amiibos. *42:53* Um, because I had intended to open one, but I just haven't yet. *42:58* Yes. *43:02* And I keep most of my amiibos sealed. *43:03* I tried to do that. *43:05* I only have three unopened or three opened out of my collection. *43:06* I tried to do that in the beginning. *43:12* But I quickly ran out of shelf real estate, and so I decided to open them. *43:14* And I've opened pretty much everything since. *43:19* I actually only have *43:21* four amiibo ironically behind me on a shelf uh still sealed Sora. *43:23* I intentionally bought two Soras to keep one sealed. *43:29* And then I have the Tears of the Kingdom three set, all three of them. *43:32* Nice. *43:36* And I just haven't opened them yet. *43:37* Because I do have I have every link amiibo. *43:38* Er no, scratch that. *43:43* I am missing two Link Amiibo, two Breath of the Wild ones, the hooded Rider and *43:44* Uh, what's the other one? *43:53* Maybe I do have the bow and arrow one, so maybe I am just missing the hooded rider. *43:55* Um, anyway, I'm in keeping up with the Zelda ones. *43:59* As just a brief side tangent and I want to get your idea, like input. *44:04* I miss green tunic link. *44:08* Like I never got sold on near naked, like Roman Link from Tears or Blue Tunic Link. *44:10* I missed like my classic green tune. *44:18* I'm a purist. *44:21* I am so much of a purist that I would not go fight Ganon. *44:22* Or Calamity Ganon in Breath of the Wild until I did all of the shrines and got the classic tunic outfit *44:29* And I remember Logan calling me, like, he's like, What are you doing? *44:37* Just go fight. *44:40* I'm like, no, I gotta be garbed in in this game's version of the green tunic. *44:40* It wasn't good enough to play with, you know, the ones you can't *44:46* scan in from an amiibo. *44:48* It was I need to be in in like this world's green tunic. *44:49* So I'm right there with you. *44:54* Big f I mean I like the *44:55* The Breath of the Wild and Tears designs just visually, but Link is always in a the green tunic. *44:58* The only acceptable alternative outfit, and this is purely because of my childhood. *45:07* is the uh the lobster shirt from Wind Waker. *45:12* Yeah. *45:16* The blue shirt. *45:16* That's the only acceptable alternative. *45:17* And that's after you beat the game. *45:19* Yeah, it's a nice little bonus. *45:24* Yes. *45:26* See, we agree. *45:26* We're on the same page. *45:27* Okay. *45:28* Sorry about that tangent. *45:29* No, you're totally fine. *45:30* Those are the tangents that are worth it. *45:31* Uh but for Paper Mario, I I picked up a copy and I just I had to boot it up just to see it. *45:33* It was kinda they announced it and I was like it I still don't believe this is real. *45:40* Like it it's so hard to believe *45:45* Even though I have it now in the house. *45:48* And it's just stunning. *45:50* Just visually. *45:51* It's just like I'm it's like coming home, you know. *45:52* I it feels so good. *45:56* And *45:59* I was actually um you know Tomas, right? *46:01* Tomas Franzi Yeah So Tomas interviewed me for a digital trends article and about like why the *46:04* the uh Thousand Year Doors d got the remake it deserved, which is cool. *46:12* I'll I'll have a link to that in the show notes his um his article. *46:17* But the thing that I was most excited about *46:20* Was the fact that this game that the Paper Mario fandom, as eclectic and weird as we all are, we have *46:24* Almost unanimously touted Thousand Your Door is the best one. *46:33* And the problem with Thousand Your Door is it is always trapped. *46:37* on the GameCube, there was you know you could play the original through Virtual Console and actually you can now on the Switch through NSO. *46:41* So like the original is still accessible in some format. *46:49* And then the Super Paper Mario, the Wii, it's fairly cheap and still playable on up through. *46:52* I guess now that's the next trapped one if you're going back as far as you can. *47:00* is Super Paper Mario. *47:05* And then the 3DS one, you know, that just shut down a year ago, I think. *47:06* So now it's trapped. *47:11* But we always touted Thousand Your Door as the best and it was getting harder and harder for people to access it and to play it. *47:13* And so I'm just so excited for a generation *47:20* of people who have either grown up hearing about this game, think and like, well, how do I play it? *47:24* Having access to it. *47:30* Or people who have never *47:31* played a paper Mario game before in their life and they just like they see it and they think it's cool just like I did when I saw a demo kiosk in Target and thought Mario folding into a paper airplane was the coolest thing I had ever seen. *47:34* in my life. *47:45* And I think that's what is most exciting about this is finally it's just an affordable *47:47* way to play this really great game. *47:54* And it seems like critically people seem to think that it still holds up and makes at least me not feel like I've been crazy for the last twenty years. *47:55* Yeah, I mean you can't escape just the the praise that everyone puts on um Thousand Year Door. *48:06* Like whenever a new paper marker comes out, it's like *48:14* But it but is it like Thousand Year Door? *48:17* Um so it it's good that Nintendo decided they wanna print they wanted to print some money with releasing this Finally print some money with it. *48:19* Um the fact *48:29* that they still haven't ported over Twilight Princess or Wind Waker to Switch still buggles my mind, but that's neither here nor there. *48:30* I imagine that's I mean it has to be this year. *48:39* Zelda Zelda is an annual franchise, sneakily, and uh with the Switch entering its twilight years. *48:42* Uh, I feel like now's the time, like this summer direct whenever it is. *48:50* I feel like Shadow dropping at Nintendo Direct in the next month. *48:55* Yeah. *48:59* They'll d uh they'll just be like, and the Zelda games are coming, whether they're separate or together. *49:00* And they'll be like, and the Metroid Prime games are coming, whether they're separate or together. *49:05* It's like gonna be this remake, remaster Palooza here at the end of the year, which I'm fine with. *49:09* uh as we gear up for whatever super switch turns out to be. *49:15* Yeah. *49:19* But yeah, it's just I'm so happy that this game is real, this game exists, and *49:20* I can't wait to play it. *49:27* I will I I won't play it right now. *49:30* Um not that I couldn't or wouldn't. *49:32* I I would love to play it right now. *49:35* It's just not on my priority list and *49:37* I'm not in a hurry to play it. *49:39* Like it's always been there and it always will be there. *49:41* I have noticed a couple of changes. *49:44* Apparently, like the color of your Yoshi, the method to *49:46* How you would select that is different, which I find a little interesting. *49:51* Seems a little more precise. *49:55* Um, I don't know. *49:57* It's cool. *49:59* I just I want to see what I really would love and uh *50:00* It's I guess it's hard to find out, but like I want to know what the kids and people who have never played it before think about it. *50:04* Like that's what I really want to know is *50:11* Yeah, I know how I feel about it, and I know how like your average gamer would probably feel about it. *50:14* Yeah. *50:20* Who's aware of it, but the people who are new to it, I don't know, that seems cool. *50:21* Do you th like what do you think the future of Paper Mario is now? *50:26* Like, we had Origami King, which was interesting, an interesting game, but not *50:31* traditional in the sense of traditional RPG mechanics and whatnot, but what do you do you think this is a sign enough *50:38* The future here? *50:48* Not not in the least. *50:48* I think they're I think I think when they eventually do another paper Mario, it'll go back to not being like Thousand Year Door. *50:50* Um, I think we'll have some weird mechanic that peep that will be divisive um and be light on RPG mechanics *50:59* And people will be all a whole new generation will be like, but this isn't like paper thousand year door. *51:08* Um but no, I don't *51:16* I do not see Nintendo suddenly after all these years with a with this remaster seeing the error of their ways and uh *51:18* Giving people what they want in a Paper Mario game. *51:29* I agree. *51:33* I agree. *51:35* One of the things I took away from playing all of them back to back in Chapter Select was uh *51:36* Paper Mario has never been traditional in that sense. *51:41* Like they always have new mechanics. *51:44* And and that makes actually Thousand Year Door the odd one out, where it was more of a refined sequel than *51:46* any of the future games would ever be. *51:54* Like every game after it is different significantly. *51:56* And so I feel like it's Paper Mario's nature to change. *52:01* which is aggravating to peop to fans of the the first two games specifically. *52:06* But yeah, I think I think whatever the next paper Mario is, it's gonna be a wholly unique idea and *52:12* People will either love it or hate it. *52:20* It'll have good ideas, it'll have bad ideas. *52:22* If there is anything though that they take away from the response here to the remake and implement into the future. *52:24* I really would just love to see unique characters again. *52:34* Um after a few games where everyone is just a toad. *52:39* I really want to see, you know, Goombas and Koopas talking and interacting that aren't all just the villain characters. *52:44* They're *52:52* Yeah. *52:52* They're just normal citizens of the mushroom kingdom or wherever it is. *52:53* Like that's what I I'm not even asking for partners. *52:57* Like I've I've let that go too. *53:00* I just want it to interact with unique Mario themed characters. *53:02* characters in towns and levels and things like that. *53:05* That's all I really want. *53:09* And no more origami, please. *53:10* They're they look so creepy. *53:12* The other thing again, I was scrolling through your Twitter just to like touch base where you are. *53:15* Get a pulse on what you've been up to. *53:20* I had no idea you wrote board game reviews. *53:23* I had no idea you were such a huge board game person, but *53:27* Lo and behold, you're out here you're at PAX East playing a bunch of board games. *53:31* I think you have a board game table like one of those I do big fancy ones from a kick *53:35* starter or something like it's supposed to be a nice table, right? *53:40* Like a really nice table. *53:43* Oh yeah. *53:44* It it's like handcrafted black walnut um large table. *53:44* gaming table that we also use is our dining room table. *53:49* It is a very very nice um piece of furniture that will be around for a long time. *53:52* That doubles is a great board game table *53:56* Like it's recessed. *53:59* We currently we have a puzzle set up in the kind of the um the trough underneath the the topper part. *54:00* And yeah, it's it's good time. *54:07* It's pretty. *54:09* You're so you're a big board game guy. *54:10* And I am *54:12* I saw that you had written a review on at least on IGN, I'm sure you've written reviews other places for like this Guilty Gear strive board game. *54:13* You wrote an article about best beginner board games, which some of those I have played. *54:21* Uh and do enjoy like Ticket to Ride or um is it Azul? *54:26* Yeah, Azul, Betrayal at the Haunted I just always say like Betrayal at the house on the hill, but that's not the name. *54:30* I c I can't get uh the correct uh string of names either, so I have the Scooby-Doo version of that game. *54:38* That one's cute. *54:48* Um, not as tough, but cute. *54:50* So immediately my brain went to how like what's your approach to doing a board game review? *54:52* Like I have a lot of friends who are super into board games and I am like the slightly above casual board game player. *54:59* Like I'll play whatever. *55:05* You teach me the rules, I'll play whatever. *55:07* But uh I do not have the breadth or depth of understanding of board games and their mechanics that I see a lot of friends have. *55:09* So the I'm fascinated by this. *55:17* It definitely poses a different um problem like different problems when approached than when compared to like a video game review. *55:20* Um it's a lot more of a event almost. *55:29* Um, 'cause you gotta find people to play and then you gotta different modes, but it's uh I I love playing board games. *55:34* It's uh it's a hobby that I've really dove into probably the past four or five years. *55:42* The COVID boom. *55:48* Yeah, even like pre COVID, but but yeah, the past few years actually it's most of my collecting has been post COVID. *55:50* Okay. *56:00* Um *56:00* But like before COVID I was always into like Magic the Gathering. *56:01* I love card like collectible or trading card games. *56:05* And then yeah, I just kind of started going into the board game space and watching board game YouTubers and watching l playthroughs of of things and that got me hooked and *56:09* Just started playing and loving 'em and yeah. *56:21* Now I'm doing buyers guides and reviews and all sorts of cool stuff. *56:25* So it's been fun. *56:30* So talk to me about PAX and board games at PAX, because the one and only time I went, I saw the board game area, but I didn't even go in there. *56:32* I was there for, you know, all the video game stuff of PAX. *56:40* Is it similar in the sense that like uh developers are there showing off and previewing and playtesting their board games too? *56:45* Is it it's the exact same vibe? *56:53* N not really, not at like Pax East or West. *56:57* So there's a board game specific PAX. *57:00* There's PAX Unplugged, which is just board games, just tabletop things, where you get a lot more of those things. *57:02* And then Gen Con like tabletop *57:07* have like their own big events. *57:09* Um but in terms of like the PAX East and whatnot, um you have a huge space for people to play board games. *57:12* Like there's a lot of board game vendors. *57:20* So y a lot of people will buy board games and then set up and play 'em um with friends and and random people on the show floor. *57:22* So that's there's a big play area and that play area is also open later than the main show floor. *57:30* Um, some people can stay around and play games, but there are some developers or and publishers that appear um and do demos and that you can also buy games from. *57:36* Um, but the vendors are the the big the have the most presence I would say in terms of the tabletop *57:47* Gotcha. *57:56* For PAX East and West, yeah. *57:57* I want to circle back to this review thing and like you have to you have to get people together to play the game because that seems like the biggest difference to me. *57:59* I remember the one game *58:07* I had I reviewed that I had to get friends together to play was Shovel Knight Showdown. *58:09* Yeah. *58:17* And I wanted to see what the party *58:17* m the multiplayer was like with people and that was easy. *58:20* Like I just said, hey guys, I'm doing this review, like help me play this. *58:26* But it took, you know, maybe an hour, because it's just a Smash Brothers take *58:30* thing. *58:35* But a board game is such or I they're not all like this, but they can be such an investment where it's you're coming over one night or afternoon, we're sitting down, we're *58:35* Um, we're learning the game, or I'm teaching you about the game, and then we're playing a few rounds and or yeah, or our game, you know. *58:47* It's a much harder commitment, it sounds like, to get people together to play for from a work perspective of like, hey guys, I also have this deadline where I gotta write about this, can you help me out type thing? *58:55* What *59:07* How do you how do you round up the the pals for that? *59:08* Yeah, so in terms of like stuff that I've done for IGN *59:12* Um, the the two reviews I've done and I have a couple more that I'm working on right now, it's far less embargo restrictive for that reason. *59:18* So ideally I would love an opportunity to get preview builds of things that are going to like Kickstarter, because the Kickstarter and crowdfunding scene for board games and tabletop stuff is immense right now. *59:28* Um with those it's much more of a time constraint, but you also don't usually get many full reviews of those. *59:41* You'll get impressions and um and breakdowns, but *59:50* with board game reviews, it's you tr you I I don't have that same time crunch. *59:54* Yes, I want to get it out in a rather re relatively timely um *01:00:02* uh schedule, especially when I get sent a game, but it's not like, oh, embargo lifts on X date, I have to play through a 60-hour long RPG. *01:00:08* I mean, those are far more difficult. *01:00:18* than getting out something for a board game because like with Guilty Gears Strive, it's a card game, games can take *01:00:20* Okay, maybe about thirty minutes, maybe forty-five minutes if it's really back and forth. *01:00:30* But f for *01:00:36* five or so games in, I have a pretty good understanding of okay, these are this is the system, these are the mechanics I like, these are where I kind of find my sh *01:00:38* the sh the game's shortcomings. *01:00:48* So in a lot of regards it's also not nearly as big of a time commitment. *01:00:50* You *01:00:56* And I have a number of friends in different friend groups that like board games, so if I'm, hey, do you want to come over for an afternoon or a day or meet up at a the local brewery, I have a game I need to *01:00:57* Test for review, I'll buy you a drink. *01:01:10* It's worked out pretty good, so buying a drink probably helps. *01:01:13* Yeah. *01:01:17* I that it sounds like a fun *01:01:19* creative challenge, at least to me, from the like critical writing perspective of I've I understand that board games are games and have game design and there's tons of interesting mechanics and *01:01:23* Like I get all of that, I understand it. *01:01:34* But when I go to a friend's house for a board game night, 'cause sorta like *01:01:37* Smash Brothers Ultimate, I don't have all the characters unlocked on my Switch because whenever we play as a group, it's always on someone else's Switch. *01:01:42* Same thing with board games. *01:01:49* We never come to my house to play because I don't have a ton of board games. *01:01:50* We just go to someone else's house who has. *01:01:54* what feels like a library of board games. *01:01:56* And so I'm always playing something different and I I guess innately I'm picking up on things that I like or don't like or mechanics. *01:01:59* and things like that. *01:02:07* But I've never thought about a board game critically in the sense of how would I approach this. *01:02:08* And so it sounds like a fun and interesting cr writing challenge to *01:02:13* I don't know, shift the way I think. *01:02:20* Cause when I play a video game, I I'm thinking about it critically on some level, right? *01:02:22* Do you when you play board games, are you on some level thinking about them in that critical way? *01:02:27* I don't think so, and it's and maybe it's because I haven't done enough *01:02:35* board games, like board game reviews, but I feel like because you're so much more ingrained in like having to pay attention to the mechanics and like *01:02:41* how things fit together matter so much more and it's like much more tactile. *01:02:52* Like you kind of instinctively look at things as a critical. *01:02:57* There are definitely aspects of games that I have come to realize that *01:03:01* matter more to me than others, like a good storage solution. *01:03:05* Like how long does it take me to actually get it to the table? *01:03:09* Is it easy is there a good organizational structure? *01:03:12* Like does *01:03:15* the boxer instructions tell me how to put everything back where it's supposed to fit so it plays nicely or like little things like that. *01:03:16* Um *01:03:24* But I guess when I'm like playing with friends, it's also very I c because it's an interactive and very uh *01:03:25* group based thing. *01:03:34* I was like, what you guys think of it? *01:03:36* Like, what didn't you like and things they might have picked up on? *01:03:37* Oh, I I *01:03:42* I didn't really like how this was handled. *01:03:43* It g I can get a lot of different perspectives and kind of viewpoints all at once to kind of help me also be critical. *01:03:45* It's like, these are just normal people playing games. *01:03:51* So I'm getting a view of what other people might just randomly pick up on that they might not like or what they appreciated. *01:03:55* So it's also because it it's almost a collaborative experience. *01:04:01* So it helps that helps me be critical and kind of know what to look into a bit more. *01:04:06* So *01:04:13* That's actually that sounds even more cool. *01:04:14* I c the only I think one of the only video games that I've done I didn't even review it. *01:04:16* I helped someone review it. *01:04:23* Uh Logan was reviewing *01:04:24* EA's anthem back when we were at Dual Shockers and we got, I don't know, I think three or four codes or something for it. *01:04:27* And so he gave me one and I played that game with him to help with the review. *01:04:34* And that was a fun and interesting process because at least that game in particular, we were just ripping it to shreds while we were playing it. *01:04:39* And *01:04:45* That's cool to think of 'cause reviewing a video game does feel often in isolation unless you know other, you know, buddies in the press that are also reviewing it and you guys sort of *01:04:47* breaking embargo by talking to each other anyway. *01:04:57* Uh you know, I guess that's the only time. *01:05:00* So yeah, it's actually a far more social reviewing experience, it sounds like, which is cool, actually. *01:05:04* That's neat. *01:05:10* I like the sound of that. *01:05:11* Yeah, I mean there are some games you can play solo in addition to multiplayer, but I *01:05:13* A majority of people play board games as a social experience. *01:05:21* They play it with friends, what they play it with people at board game cafes and stuff, so *01:05:25* It it makes it fun to, you know, gives me a reason to hang out with friends, so yeah, it's good. *01:05:30* Yeah. *01:05:38* It's different, but I I value it a lot. *01:05:39* I love it. *01:05:43* I like the sound of it. *01:05:44* I'm I'm curious. *01:05:45* So what's the hot or not the hot? *01:05:47* Like what's your favorite game right now? *01:05:50* I I feel like the *01:05:51* uh board game wise, I feel like this is something that changes quite a bit. *01:05:52* Like what are you what's like your your go-to game right now? *01:05:56* Um *01:06:00* It's hard to have a go-to game when, like, to your point, I can only meet up with friends once a month, maybe twice a month if I'm lucky. *01:06:02* Well, like just what are you feeling lately? *01:06:11* I I'm really enjoying, like, they really nailed the Slay the Spireboard game. *01:06:13* Okay. *01:06:17* That is really, really good. *01:06:19* They really nailed *01:06:21* the feel and being able to play it co-op with my f like I played through it with um m my friends I brought to um my friends house a couple weekends ago for our monthly game night um and we played through uh a couple acts. *01:06:22* And they nailed it. *01:06:37* It's it's a lot of fun. *01:06:38* Um and then I'm really liking right now I'm in a big kick to play like war games. *01:06:40* Um, like whether it's like access and allies, I wanna kinda get into that. *01:06:46* Uh risk. *01:06:49* Um uh Dune Imperium uh is a big one, really popular, really fun kind of area control deck building game. *01:06:51* And I also bought um War of the Ring, which is like this big s war game set in the middle or set in the Lord of the Rings time frame where one people *01:07:00* Or or one player's the one or two players are the free peoples and the others are the evil Sauron groups and there's like a hundred plus little miniatures that you *01:07:11* maneuver and then you have the fellowship and you can throw the ring in Mount Doom to win. *01:07:23* It's um I'm very anxious and excited to to get a chance to table that and play. *01:07:29* But *01:07:34* Was that a Kickstarter? *01:07:35* No. *01:07:37* So that's been out for a while. *01:07:37* So that was a I watched YouTube videos and my *01:07:39* Resolve broke and I ordered it off of Amazon. *01:07:44* That seems to be the way most of this stuff goes. *01:07:48* I uh *01:07:51* I rem I don't even remember how I found out about Root, but I found out I love Root. *01:07:53* I love Root. *01:07:59* I mean, I wish we lived closer because my my hurdle with Root is *01:08:00* At least like the group of people that I've played with, it always has changed. *01:08:07* So it always is explaining the game to people every time. *01:08:12* And it just takes so much longer. *01:08:16* And the real *01:08:19* Like the real kickers, Abby does not enjoy root. *01:08:21* Um, so I don't have like a built-in house buddy to play with. *01:08:24* Um *01:08:28* So I don't play it as much as I would like, but I do love Root. *01:08:29* Root is very fun. *01:08:34* So you should check out um the digital version of Root. *01:08:35* I think very, very good. *01:08:42* I think I have the mobile version *01:08:46* But not the one on computer, I think. *01:08:50* I'd have to check. *01:08:52* Um But I assume that has multiplayer like an online. *01:08:53* Yeah. *01:08:57* Okay. *01:08:57* That probably helps significantly. *01:08:58* But yeah, it's by a group, um *01:09:00* They c they're called Direwolf Digital and they've handled a lot of digital adaptations of board games and they do really good like they have a really good munchkin digital adaptation, Everdell, Sagarda. *01:09:02* Um they have a lot of really good games. *01:09:15* They have uh digital version of Clank coming out soon, which is a really fun deck builder and kind of dungeon diving one. *01:09:17* Um but yeah, it's uh *01:09:24* It's good. *01:09:27* They they got good stuff. *01:09:28* Okay, so Root is on mobile on the respective app stores. *01:09:30* It's on Steam. *01:09:36* Uh and it's on the Nintendo Switch. *01:09:37* I did not uh see now that's more enticing. *01:09:40* Cause I don't oh it is on Mac on PC, so I could do that too. *01:09:44* Oh *01:09:48* Interesting. *01:09:49* Very interesting. *01:09:50* I will Yeah, I don't know if it's crossplay. *01:09:52* Probably not. *01:09:57* I'm not a hundred percent sure. *01:09:58* But yeah, I mean the digital version's really *01:10:01* Solid. *01:10:03* Oh, and they have the expansions. *01:10:04* Yep. *01:10:06* Oh, very good. *01:10:07* Yeah, that's 15 bucks. *01:10:09* I have Underworld and River Folk. *01:10:12* I did not get clockwork. *01:10:14* And I don't know what this exiles partisans and vagabonds. *01:10:17* Anyway, okay. *01:10:22* Duly noted. *01:10:23* I will look into that. *01:10:24* Thank you. *01:10:26* Very, very cool. *01:10:26* I um you mentioned Kickstarter. *01:10:28* is like hot. *01:10:31* It's the board game hotness. *01:10:32* And this is this is true and has been true. *01:10:34* Uh and I've only I've only backed *01:10:37* A couple of games on Kickstarter. *01:10:40* I don't have a long list of Kickstarter backers. *01:10:42* I have a keyboard, one set of puzzles. *01:10:44* And uh two books and two games. *01:10:48* So I got Dustbiters, which was is a very light I think only two players card game, very Mad Max inspired *01:10:51* It's from I am 8-bit. *01:11:02* It's very cool. *01:11:04* Very quick. *01:11:05* That's fun. *01:11:05* And then uh I got because I am me, I got the Last of Us board game. *01:11:07* Which is supposed to be sometime this year, but you know, things get delayed all the time. *01:11:13* But it looks super cool. *01:11:19* Um, have you ever played the Escape the Dark games? *01:11:22* Cause Yes. *01:11:26* I have Escape the Dark Castle, and it's fantastic. *01:11:27* Tell me about it. *01:11:31* Because I have not found anyone in person who has played it, and uh I only I truly only know *01:11:32* that I like the art style. *01:11:40* Yeah. *01:11:42* So talk to me about it. *01:11:43* Yeah, it's a super atmospheric like the like the like you mentioned, the art style, but super atmospheric. *01:11:45* It's very easy to pick up and play. *01:11:52* Um, it's like a dungeon crawling, randomly generated dungeon that's hard to to succeed at and you roll dice and you have like a character that have *01:11:55* their own specific dice that are slightly better at succeeding in certain checks and it's um it's a lot of fun. *01:12:05* I've it's a it's a small enough game that it's great to take to the bar with you. *01:12:13* Um I I've taken it to the brewery um and played with some friends or my local barcade um and played it there, but I don't have any of the expansions for Dark Castle. *01:12:18* And I don't I haven't played Dark Sector, but I really, really like uh Escape from Dark Castle, which was the first game they did. *01:12:28* Yes. *01:12:36* I uh *01:12:37* I have in my Amazon list wish list the sector one because I like space. *01:12:38* That was the but I have not obviously bought it. *01:12:44* And now that I've bought the Last of Us one, I'm like, well, I will just play this one first then *01:12:47* uh again leaning into my identity I suppose but it looks I mean I'll have a link to this in the show notes as well you at the very least just go look at the art either for the last of I'll have all three of them in there *01:12:51* You should do the art is stunning. *01:13:05* It truly is. *01:13:06* I and I'm excited about the you know to learn and play this game and all this stuff, but *01:13:08* The Kickstarters seem to be where all this board game stuff is happening. *01:13:13* I mean, I bet there's a whole category, probably. *01:13:17* Oh yeah. *01:13:21* Have you played uh *01:13:22* Gloomhaven, because that was one I found out just because it costs so flippin' much and weighs even more. *01:13:24* Um I I so I've played the digital version of Gloomhaven. *01:13:32* I reviewed that. *01:13:36* Um Okay. *01:13:36* And I I do own the physical version of Gloomhaven. *01:13:38* Haven as well that I haven't that's one of the ones where it's those are hard because they're campaign games and they like require you to have a consistent party to play, group to play. *01:13:40* Yeah. *01:13:51* Um but one day I'll I'll play *01:13:51* Real. *01:13:54* That's like uh we as a group are gonna commit to this for the next so long. *01:13:55* I'm I'm looking at so if you just go to Kickstarter and click on the games tab. *01:14:01* I don't actually think there's a single video game here on the front page of all of this, which is totally fine. *01:14:08* Uh *01:14:15* Oh no, maybe I found a video game. *01:14:17* I don't know. *01:14:19* There's some This is the thing about board games. *01:14:19* I feel like they *01:14:23* More so than video games today. *01:14:25* Actually, this is 1000% true, I feel like. *01:14:28* Back in the day, a video game *01:14:32* I'm thinking specifically of renting, but it could have been when you were in Toys R Us or whatever. *01:14:34* You walk, you look at the box, and you go, That looks cool. *01:14:38* I wanna play that. *01:14:42* Yeah. *01:14:43* I feel like *01:14:44* That doesn't matter now with video games. *01:14:45* I feel like the packaging is so vital for a board game still. *01:14:47* There's a Oh yeah. *01:14:51* I mean th the top game right here is Vicious Gardens, a brutally fun gardening game. *01:14:52* Which okay, that sounds cool. *01:14:59* I've played the bird game before. *01:15:02* If they can make gardening exciting, then why not? *01:15:04* But the art is stunning. *01:15:07* Yeah. *01:15:10* On these cards. *01:15:11* And I think a lot of board games or card games or or what have you. *01:15:12* The art *01:15:17* Like the pro the presentation seems to go very far in the board game world. *01:15:18* Wingspan, that's the bird game. *01:15:23* Yeah. *01:15:25* And they have a dragon version of that now. *01:15:25* I saw. *01:15:27* Yep, worm span. *01:15:28* I got that because I thought those the uh whatchamacallit, the birds were stupid. *01:15:29* And I know it's supposed to be really good, but I just can't bring myself to play bird game. *01:15:33* That's fine. *01:15:37* Um kind of along those same lines, I'll send you a picture right now. *01:15:38* There's this small little card game, it's called Sea Salt and Paper, and all the art on the card is paper origami. *01:15:42* Like just pictures of origami. *01:15:49* Um, and that's a very good game I've heard. *01:15:52* I haven't played it myself, but yeah, just fits in your hand. *01:15:54* Um, really, really popular. *01:15:57* Um lightweight game, but yeah, uses just cool pictures of origami for their cards and um *01:16:00* Yeah, it's there's such a variety of games in the board game space. *01:16:11* Which has been really exciting to dive into and kind of witness. *01:16:19* It feels I mean, I have uh one *01:16:24* group of friends specifically one family and like I said they have a library of games and it is it is like walking into *01:16:28* that rental store back in the day, that blockbuster, that Hollywood video. *01:16:39* And I truly I truly just hand myself over to them. *01:16:43* I'm like, I don't even know *01:16:48* what all these games are. *01:16:50* Sure there are a few favorites I have that I've picked up on by playing with them. *01:16:51* Um the Quacks of Quigglemeyer or whatever. *01:16:56* It's *01:17:00* like a Whitlinberg or whatever. *01:17:00* Yeah, yeah. *01:17:01* I like that one a lot. *01:17:03* Um they have a I think it's called Dice Forge or something. *01:17:05* That's a cool game where you like *01:17:08* Build dice. *01:17:10* But other than that, I just I give myself over to them. *01:17:11* But I do go and look at these games that they have and the boxes and the spines and like that looks super cool. *01:17:15* They're *01:17:21* Uh maybe because it is it's mm, how do I phrase this? *01:17:23* The development of a board game I think has more flexibility in its presentation. *01:17:31* than in a video game and probably can iterate faster to find the design that you want because *01:17:41* Again, this is all me talking out of ignorance, but like these origami cards, I feel like iterating on that probably was quick. *01:17:50* and then refining it is what took the time. *01:18:00* But if you were generating all of these like crazy 3D paper Mario origami assets it took however long it was to make *01:18:03* that game. *01:18:10* I don't know. *01:18:11* I it board games are very unique, it feels like, and it just kind of the last five *01:18:11* years and I'm only saying that because that seems to be when my friends like really got whole hog into to board games to the nth degree. *01:18:19* But I've j my eyes have been open to this entire world and it is cool to observe I just can't financially invest into it the level that the they have, but *01:18:29* Uh again, I guess I have acsa I have a library card essentially by being friends with them, I suppose. *01:18:39* So kind of in terms of the iteration aspect, one of the things that the board game admits the board game world has *01:18:45* um is they can rely on a lot of people trying their game for no cost to them thanks to things like tabletop simulator on Steam or Tabletopia *01:18:53* and things along those lines where they can push demos or they can invite people to play in essence their mod *01:19:07* which is their game, get feedback and then quickly just in essence make a patch. *01:19:15* Okay, we're gonna add some more cards. *01:19:20* We're gonna change the wording of this. *01:19:21* How do you feel then? *01:19:23* So they can get a lot of people trying their game. *01:19:24* for no real cost to the player and no real cost to the developer, but they can get lots of feedback, which I think which in interviews and things I've done with *01:19:27* um developers and people that have made board games is incredibly instrumental in an incredibly powerful tool they use. *01:19:38* That makes sense. *01:19:47* And it's interesting. *01:19:49* It's like public playtesting. *01:19:50* Yeah. *01:19:53* Essentially. *01:19:54* And just I actually, you know what? *01:19:55* Now that I'm thinking about it, I think one of the updates *01:19:57* During the whole Last of Us Escape the Dark process was a playtest of in tabletop simulator. *01:20:01* Here's the post. *01:20:10* Um *01:20:11* Wow, okay. *01:20:12* Very inch it's that's a little ironic. *01:20:14* They're using a video game and iterating on it in a video game to then create the physical board game. *01:20:17* Very cool. *01:20:24* What an interesting crossover of worlds. *01:20:25* But like honestly, if you're big if you ever want to play board games, I like there is tabletop simulator could download a it's usually 20 bucks *01:20:27* But on Steam, but then always goes down on for sale. *01:20:39* Sure. *01:20:43* Um and then just you use mods, it's great. *01:20:43* Um, but then there's Board Game Arena, which is a browser-based *01:20:46* um online board game kind of um service. *01:20:51* Mm-hmm. *01:20:56* It's thirty six bucks for a year and you get sss like *01:20:57* Hundreds of games you can play with friends. *01:21:00* You have Azul you can play on there, um, Heat, Ticket to Ride, all these games, and they a lot of them have really good Um tutorials so you can learn new games *01:21:02* It is a wonderful service. *01:21:13* Okay. *01:21:17* No. *01:21:17* It is an official site. *01:21:18* Like offici everything's made through there. *01:21:19* Really, really well done. *01:21:22* Um, I love to use it. *01:21:23* Um and with it being browser based, it's great for all manner can do it. *01:21:25* Yeah. *01:21:30* But no, like they had like *01:21:31* w official wingspan is on there, terraforming Mars, Azul, Jaipur, Lost Ruins of Arnak, you have family games, you have uh tile plasmid drafting, solo games, short games, competitive, cooperative, just *01:21:32* And then you also have like your classic like card games and and things, so huh. *01:21:47* See man, I'm learning a whole new world out there. *01:21:53* Oh yeah. *01:21:55* But yeah, you have like friends lists, you can play with friends. *01:21:57* There's like tournaments they hold on this thing. *01:22:00* You have like a little ranking. *01:22:02* It's all sorts of good stuff. *01:22:04* Huh, cool. *01:22:07* There will be a link to those in the show notes as well. *01:22:08* Wow. *01:22:12* Catan? *01:22:12* Catan's on here. *01:22:14* Yeah. *01:22:15* Staple for sure. *01:22:16* Huh, uh leaderboards? *01:22:18* The whole deal, whole nine yards. *01:22:20* Huh. *01:22:22* Yeah. *01:22:22* Very, very cool. *01:22:24* Highly recommend if you like board games. *01:22:26* Plus it's cheap, like thirty-six bucks for a year. *01:22:28* It's three bucks a month for their premium service. *01:22:30* And if you and if you don't want a premium service *01:22:33* You can play for free. *01:22:36* Um, there are some games that are locked to you, but if like say you still wanted to play and I wanted to play, because I have a premium service, I can just invite you to my game, so you can still play. *01:22:37* You just can't start those games. *01:22:46* Oh wow. *01:22:48* So that's like a download play on the DS. *01:22:49* Like if I own a game, so you know, like Mario Kart DS, you could only be a shy guy, but you could still play the whole game and race everything. *01:22:52* Huh. *01:23:00* Yeah. *01:23:01* Neat. *01:23:02* Well, I think that does it, Scott. *01:23:03* It's ten o'clock. *01:23:06* It's both our dad bodies bedtimes. *01:23:07* So Daddy bedtimes, yeah. *01:23:11* Daddy bed times. *01:23:12* Thank you so much for coming on the show, man. *01:23:14* I really, really appreciate it. *01:23:17* Folks can find you online. *01:23:19* You're at professorrpg. *01:23:21* Yep. *01:23:23* Great handle. *01:23:24* Great handle. *01:23:25* Uh you you write over at uh what is the website's name? *01:23:26* RPG. *01:23:31* RPG site. *01:23:32* RPG site. *01:23:33* Uh I do stuff for IGN now. *01:23:35* Um and then Irrational Passions. *01:23:37* I'm *01:23:39* also still over there doing stuff so very cool all right irrational irrational passions rpg site IGN Yep *01:23:39* Those are the places to be. *01:23:47* And my podcast will be back looking at August, just taking a bit of a mental breather uh with RPG University *01:23:49* Um just it just gets busy and hectic. *01:23:55* So yeah, that'll be coming back in uh in August is the plan. *01:23:58* So *01:24:04* I love it. *01:24:04* RPG RPG University. *01:24:05* Check it out. *01:24:08* Uh Scott does have an episode on Paper Mar and The Thousand Year Door with *01:24:09* Diablo which number? *01:24:14* Diablo's uh creator, the creator of Diablo David Brevik. *01:24:16* Yeah, it turns out he really likes Paper Mario. *01:24:20* There you go. *01:24:23* See, you should go check that out. *01:24:24* You should go check out the show in general, but there's a specific episode recommendation for you. *01:24:25* Uh, and go check out Scott's work at all those sites. *01:24:30* Links will be in the show notes. *01:24:33* As for me, you can find all of my writing and stuff over at maxfrequency. *01:24:35* net, which since the last episode of this podcast has gone over a major redesign, so you can go check that out. *01:24:39* And then my other show Chapter Select a seasonal podcast where we bounce back and forth between a series, exploring its evolution design, and legacy *01:24:46* Uh like we said earlier, season one was Paper Mario. *01:24:54* Scott was on our Thousand Your Door episode, but uh we've done a whopping six seasons so far, ranging from Paper Mario to Pokemon to Banjo Kazooie. *01:24:57* So all that stuff in between. *01:25:07* And we are currently in the works on the Metroid Prime season and a Castlevania season. *01:25:08* So *01:25:14* You can keep uh your eyes out, your ears open for those. *01:25:15* But until next time, thank you all so much for listening and adios. *01:25:19*